Denial 2015

[SoonToBe]

Rick - I just tell him she's out with girlfriends, or last night, that they went to the movies and to the diner afterwards.
It was good talking to her last night. I got home by about 10:15pm and she called right on time at 10:30pm.
She's gotten a bit more playful when she calls. Last night when I asked how she was doing she said "mmm, very nice" and she told me about her day but then told me that she's relaxing right then in just her camisole and panties while lying on his bed. I begrudgingly asked where he was and she told me he was in his office-room checking on things and giving her some privacy to call me. She still says she hasn't told him anything more about what we're doing but I'll have to ask her again as Paul seems pretty accommodating to her.

It was nice talking to her, she didn't seem rushed at all and no, I didn't ask about what "they'd done" sexually before she called but from how she sounded, they were either done or taking a break because she had this very relaxed tone about her that really only happens after she's had an orgasm or two. I was horny talking to her and told her so. Obviously she had asked me about my night and she also asked me if I was going to "relieve yourself" before bed and I told her the obvious answer of yes. She moaned softly and told me that it turned her on to hear that and she also giggled and said "leave some for tomorrow" so I am eager for her to come home this evening and hopefully repeat the last 2 weeks pattern.

Despite thoughts of not doing so, my hard-on in bed last night was fueled by all sorts of thoughts in my head. And yes, no matter what they say, a good cum before bed does help you sleep. Strangely, despite tossing and turning without her there, once I fell asleep, I slept pretty soundly.

She will usually send me an email when she gets to work and then call later on so I'm waiting for that before I can really settle into my day.
If I let my brain go to thinking too much about her I'll get no work done.

 

[dana007]

STB
Hope you had alot of fun last night.
keep us posted

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
I have been away for almost two weeks and I came back hoping to find some new enlightenment in your position and you both accelerate to the month end.

We are now over 60 pages into your denial thread, long past many of your previous adventures and still, for many of us it seems, no nearer really understanding what Sue’s real motivation is.

Your own desires have ebbed and flowed, split between the two opposing sides of a desire for denial and your more natural desire to continue to experience full intimacy with your wife and partner. This part, although difficult to understand for many, has been explained by you as best you can. You are after all a cuckold, one who derives pleasure from the thought and reality of your wife being with another man. Your comments on the desire to explore your own beta side may be understating things a bit though, it now seems more like an acceptance of the beta side of you, something that may be a more permanent part of your life although in what form and to what degree has yet to be established.

This evolution of your own character has left gaps in the partnership you have with Sue. This is normal in any marriage over time. There are the reason couples either get closer together or slowly break apart. In your case your stated desire (to Sue and us) to experience greater denial and a beta role left Sue in a new position. Someone had to assume a greater leadership and she had to find a sexual outlet elsewhere if she was to accommodate your wishes. She could have found another Dom, she had even said she would have liked to, but instead she seems to have chosen to have taken on the role herself. The sexual outlet has become Paul, but he remains little more than the human dildo I christened him earlier. In her present mood I don’t think Sue would let or want him to try to do anything else.

Sue seems to have used some of her new space to explore what she wants going forward as well and it is in this area that I think we all see the greatest confusion. From your comments this may simply be a reflection of the confusion she herself feels but the sureness of her actions elsewhere would say not. She clearly needs a healthy amount of sexual release in her life. Most of that she is currently getting from Paul but I simply cannot see that all of it can be provided that way. If she loves you as you think she does, and if your previous sex life was as good as you have written it to be than there must be a tension within her that needs release in sexual contact with you. I truly believe this to be the case and it if it is then either she is frustrated with the current arrangement and needs you to see the selfishness of your total denial fantasy OR there is an error in the assumption and either she doesn’t love you quite as much as you think or her experience of your previous sex life was somewhat lacking. She does seem to be indicating some of this in her comments but is not being explicit enough for you to understand it and accept or adapt. Her actions seem to indicate she feels no sexual desire for you at present. My worry is that nothing either of you is doing seems to point to a solution to this, either in the short or even long term. No goals, no targets, no work in progress, no discussion. Nothing. It seems odd. Can you explain it?

 

[Knk069]

Peak.
Do they really need an endpoint to work toward? After all, isn't it the point of the cuckold lifestyle to let the wife explore her sexuality to the fullest as the husband enjoys the ride? Sue is exploring. Steve is enjoying. Why not just sit back and enjoy the ride?

 

[peakmb]

Kink,
It's not me that introduced the concept of an end point, it's both Sue and Steve. The point where Sue pulls away from Paul or Steve cracks and pulls it. It's happened every time they have gone this route. It may not be happening soon of course, but it will happen.

 

[SquirmingSub]

Guys - is it really that critical that an end point be stated? Yes Steve did mention one in the past although based on my understanding of what I have read with regard to there respective interaction with Paul and the inclusion of Paul within there relationship, it simply seems that the relationship/marriage in which Steve and Sue have together continues to evolve. Behind the scene, maybe there overall goals have changed as they have continued to evolve. I am sure that Steve does not share everything with us here on the forum and Sue clearly does not post here. It has been a good ride for Steve over the years and likely will continue to be a great ride in many ways.

 

[peakmb]

Gents,
I put a lot of effort into saying what I said and asking Steve to respond. Why you think you need to deflect for him I don't know but I'm leaving it up to him to respond or not. OK?

 

[SoonToBe]

Peak - you have said a lot but I don't necessarily agree with everything. If her actions from this past Thursday evening were any example, then she is already starting to weaken and relax the total-denial stance. Indeed - I was pleasantly surprised when she allowed me to undress her and she knew that by doing so I would have more than incidental contact with her.

But before I share that I wanted to say that yes, she feels confused. I don't believe that she has no sexual desire for me, but rather that she is forcing herself to learn to restrain it and yes, for now, redirect it towards Paul. I do agree that she has assumed the dominant role in both her relationship with me as well as with Paul, that's new but not if I looked back to when we started dating as she was quite sexually confident and even demanding back then.

As far as me. While I still have thoughts of resuming the alpha role with her, I also will admit that I am enjoying the beta role with her as the alpha. Her pen-pals say she is ripe to move towards a female-led-relationship, at least sexually with me, but not in other areas of our lives. I am a bit scared and reluctant to admit to enjoying that thought for now, to remain the beta. I don't think she sees me as anything less overall, and may actually think more highly of me that I may want this, she's long said that I should feel comfortable with what turns me on and if this is it, then maybe it is. I think back to what others have said regarding continuing our denial play into the future with me having periodic times when we will re-consummate things and it is seeming crazy to me to be saying this but maybe it is what I want? How else do I explain my apparent contentment with what we've been doing now for 5 weeks.

I can't deny that I am a bit concerned and even a bit scared or hesitant about how these changes may play out. I have asked myself now if i want to be the beta on a more long-term basis. Things she says at times do make me wonder about what others here have said. But then we have this past Thursday where she let me undress her! She let me take her bra off and I stood behind her as I unclasped it, holding her around the arms and shoulders and she didn't resist me as I slid the bra off her arms, when I took her breasts in both hands and caressed them for a moment. It was just holding them gently from underneath and feeling their weight and warmth, I didn't squeeze them or play with her nipples at all, but it felt so good to hold them that it really made me want to have them more but I didn't push it.

She kissed me when she turned around and smiled when she saw my gaze was glued to them now being just inches from my chest, but at the same time, I knew that was all she wanted. What surprised me was when she said I should kneel down and pull off her panties. I was shaking as i put my fingers i the waist band and pulled them down slowly. It always turns me on to see she is still totally bare, when the top of her lips came into view and I could see her button nestled under it's hood, fuck did my cock get hard!! As she stepped out of them she spread her legs and more came into view. My cock was now dripping away in my boxers.

One her pussy spread apart I could see more and it turned me on so much to see it gently gape open and I could see the wetness inside her. She smelled sexy - not like sex - but sexy - the pheromones must have been all over! I could smell a combination of a little bit of sweat, her sweet smell and a tiny bit of an acridity that I knew must have been from him. I sooooo wanted to pull her to me as I knelt there and lick her clean but she wanted nothing of the sort.

Instead she pulled me up to my feet and said "your turn" and I knew she wanted me to strip so I pulled off my shirt and slid off my pants and she smiled at seeing my cock. She touched it for the first time in 5 weeks!!!!! LIke I'd done to her breasts, she just lay it in the palm of her hand and as if she were talking to it said "do you miss me?". I groaned "yes" back and she giggled and took her hand away and she smiled and said "show me?" I slid back onto the bed and she smiled as my cock was now at full hardness as she stood there next to the bed naked.

More in a bit

 

[SoonToBe]

I thought there might be more contact with her but there wasn't. I started stroking my cock and she asked me if I was still turned on by all of this and she asked whether I knew it would be 5 weeks this weekend. She had a big smile on her face when I told her I did and that it did still get to me, she giggled and said "I can see that" motioning to my cock that now seemed to be throbbing away. She sat next to me on the edge of the bed and asked me if I was still turned on by "not having me". I was scared to say it but I knew I should tell her the truth and I told her yes. She asked me more and I told her that I was surprised that this wasn't more difficult for either of us.

That's when she turned to me and lay down next to me with her breast just touching my arm and she said that it hasn't been easy for her either, that she doesn't like not having sex with me as her husband, but she leaned towards me and now her breast and nipple were against my side when she said "but it's what I think we both need right now" and she kissed me - quite passionately. She pulled back and said "I'm not sure when I'm going to want to let myself go with you again" and she pulled me against her where I could feel her whole body and her pussy against my hip and she said in a very sexy voice "I'm glad you'll be able to be patient with me".

I stroked away as she told me how good it felt to be with Paul again for 2 nights in a row and she took care to tell me how nice it was that they could "resume where we'd left off the night before" and I knew that meant sexually. She whispered into my ear how he joined her in the shower both mornings before work and she sizzled in my ear about how before she'd even dried off on Wednesday morning, how they had a quickie on the bed. I moaned back at how that turned me on that she felt so good about it with him. She moved up against me and told me how horny it was seeing me so hard as she talked to me and then she started to say things that she knew sent chills up my spine "he likes how I get ready while he's shaving in the morning" knowing how that turns me on. I still can't believe she will actually do this with him as she would barely do this with me while I'm in the shower much less standing next to her shaving at the sink but she whispered in my ear that "he thinks it's sexy that I don't mind peeing while he's there with me". Fuck did that get to me. I felt my orgasm really getting ready and she knew it too. I mean while I'm in the shower she'll come in and sit and do her thing and then leave but just thinking about her squtting down and peeing as if it's nothing, fuck even now it has me rock hard again. But then she knows that this almost turns me on as much as the actual sex does!

Still, there's nothing that will make me cum sooner than when she starts to talk about how it feels to fuck him and how she likes how he feels in her. It's crazy that she will just talk to me like she would maybe a girlfriend but she has no qualms about telling me how she always likes to be in the missionary position for him and how she likes to see all of him when he cums. But when she cooed in my ear and said "that's the part that really turns you on, right baby?...... when I tell you how I can feel him cum inside me, how warm I feel inside.....". And she was right. Almost without warning as she let loose with that and more that I let go and grunted and let it fly! She squealed at how I seemed to suddenly explode and she pulled back a bit to watch me stroke out the last few spurts.

As I lay there she slid down towards me again and she whispered how hot that was for her to watch. I started to moan and snuggle towards her when she surprised the heck out of me when I felt her hand on the inside of my leg moving up to my cock. I felt her push at my leg and without thinking, still catching my breath, I spread my legs and she surprised the heck out of me by putting her thumb way down by my butt and then doing what I'd told her I loved - feeling her run her thumb from way down all the way up to the tip of my cock and draw out the last bit of my cum. She moved soooo slowly that I had time to get up on my elbows and watch her bring out the last thick globs of cum which she deftly wiped onto one finger and without even thinking about it I just opened my mouth and she wiped it onto my tongue and lip.

I don't mind it, geez, after all these Wednesdays (and now Thursdays), I think I've become used to the taste and instead, I held her hand before she moved it away and I brought it back and kissed it and I looked up at her and told her I loved her. She smiled, leaned down and shared a slightly tangy kiss with me before she giggled and said "I love playing like this" and she began to play with my cum as is our usual routine. I don't know if I am conveying how close the both of us feel at that moment. i can feel her warm skin against mine, her breasts are swollen and looking aroused from how hard her nipples are. There's a heat from between her legs and after she's helped clean me up, the kiss that we share is one that I think is almost more erotic than any other time, yes, even one that we'd share after both cumming together - there's just something about the honesty of the moment that I think, at least for me, says more in 30-seconds than any talk or discussion could.

More later - gotta get somethings done around here.

 

[SoonToBe]

So - Paul will not be coming here tomorrow. As I had thought, she wants to spend some of the day at her parents so we'll be there for at least the afternoon tomorrow. She did say that "we can talk about it" when I mentioned joining her at Pauls maybe next week.

She is out now shopping for some flowers or small plants that her mom can put into pots on their porch/balcony for the summer. So I've had some time to think for the past few days. As I said, the thing that I am finding most surprising is that I seem to be content, for the time being at least, with our state of denial (although I will say that seeing some cracks in her facade this past Thursday also makes it easier too). I know others here had said that there is more to a relationship than just sexual and it's very surprising and even refreshing to feel that about Sue - that we both genuinely still really enjoy and love each other even without the sex. I am finding myself questioning whether I've maybe always under it all, wanted to be the beta? Was I really happy and horny way back in college when I didn't take a turn with that ****** at the frat-party? Did I want Sue to really get into it with her lover all along? I know that I've begun to accept certain things about myself but now, to question whether I've maybe always wanted this?

I read somewhere that sometimes guys assume they want and should be the alpha just because they have a good sized cock and can please women. But that sometimes, maybe they didn't really want that role? Obviously after 20+ years of the alpha with Sue, I have really been very into her going with other guys. The things I've found that thrilled me were when she gave things to these other guys either before or instead of me - even something going way back to how I reacted when so early on she showed Brad how to insert her diaphragm and all of that. I know that it should have really caused me concern or agonized me, but instead I found it horny. When she came to me and said she wanted to avoid sex with me before she'd see Don, I may have said I wasn't happy but in the end, I went along with it willingly. I'm a little scared to admit it to myself and I'll also say that I"m a little reluctant to share this with Sue. So.....

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
I believe from your repeated comments over the years that there is no doubt that Sue loves you as much as you do her. I can see no point in doubting that. I further believe that as you have pushed her into the path of other men over the years (perhaps willingly on her part) that Sue has had to develop and evolve her Dom role in order to control things from her perspective. You are seeing her evolved state now and some of your ‘beta’ feeling may well be the realisation that Sue can handle things by herself and doesn’t need you to control things, so you backed off. Ultimately it may not matter who started it, I do think that Sue’s control is mostly here to stay as is your partly Beta sexual role with her.

It is possible that Sue’s stricter control over you this time is a result of her time with Robert. That may have been a far greater threat to your relationship than you thought at the time. Sue spent all her time at his place, frequently overnight and raved about his stamina, his technique and his big cock. If you ask her, she may admit he was the best of her lovers and if he only wanted a fuck partner himself (like Paul appears to do), she would probably still be with him. Picture her nights from her perspective when she came home. She would have just enjoyed some of the best sex of her life from a man she felt more with than Paul. She would still have been tingling and glowing with a special sexual glow, one she would have wanted to savour as she went to sleep. Ideally in your arms, but I now suspect and not unexpectedly she would have preferred to maintain that glow and not had any sexual contact with you on those nights. I think her attitude developed over that time and after Robert drifted away, she resolved never to make that same mistake again. She thought at first that this would hurt you and repeatedly questioned how you felt about her denying you on these nights, but your own fantasies kicked in and saved her. Maybe now she is maintaining that ‘glow’ all week between visits to Paul by continuing to maintain her sexual distance from you. If you weren’t turned on by it, this would be seen to be selfish and uncaring, so she continues to check your feelings. I think unless you cracked completely, even if you said you didn’t want to be denied, the best you would get at the moment would be condom fucks on days well away from her ‘Paul’ time. But. You don’t ask for it and Sue doesn’t want to let go of the ‘glow’. It could carry on for a while. The thing that would worry me is her judgement that for some reason, sex with most of her lovers has, for much of the time perhaps, been better / more exciting than sex with you. Okay you have pushed her, but right now if you could somehow turn off your denial / cuckold need would/could Sue revert completely to only you? I don’t think you can switch your desires like that so Sue may never need to but you get my point maybe. The thing is, if Paul were magically vanish tomorrow, the first thing Sue would want to do is replace him and not revert to you. That I think would concern me a little. I say again you really need to understand what Sue wants out of this and what she wants from you long term.

 

[SquirmingSub]

Steve as always I appreciate your detailed post about your experiences and feelings. Enjoy the ride....

 

[raksdeer]

SO true Peakmb. You are so right. I think this episode with Paul will (if it not already has) permanently change their relationship.

" She would still have been tingling and glowing with a special sexual glow, one she would have wanted to savour as she went to sleep. Ideally in your arms, but I now suspect and not unexpectedly she would have preferred to maintain that glow and not had any sexual contact with you on those nights. I think her attitude developed over that time and after Robert drifted away, she resolved never to make that same mistake again"

Yes indeed that could only be the explanation of what she is feeling. And why being driven by guilt again she has thrown some tit-bits STB's way. But as she continues to ask and as STB continues to reply that yes "I am enjoying"....her resolve will become stronger and stronger. And STB won't even know about it as it will not be something that would happen over a week...but over a year or so....! She would soon stop asking....and begin telling...."You are enjoying this...aren't you?"....and then to "Enjoy this".

Would this lead to their break-up and separation. I don't think so because apparently they seem to like each other (And not love each other. Because love doesn't includes cruelty...even if the other spouse is demanding it) and they have kids together. Is Beta role permanent for STB...yes...very much so. Will STB continue to be denied endlessly? Definitely. Will they grow apart emotionally....May be....when the arousal from denial starts to ebb away...(or May be STB may prefer his own hand to Sue...as he is as of now on permanent basis...I wonder if Sue sees this as her rejection).

Just my take on it.

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
One further point. Real angst is painful. Wretching as you are pulled two ways. Split painfully between two opposing camps. Sue is not seeing that in you. She is not seeing that painful desire for her in your eyes enough. All women want this in their men, even their husbands of many years. You seem to be enjoying it a little too much. It may bbe another reason why she increased the denial so quickly. If so it backfired. She sees you are still enjoying it a little too much. I suspect that is the real reason for her little breaks in regime. Tiny treats to keep you focused. Maybe she should restrict your orgasms to the nights she is with Paul. Let you experience her denial state?

 

[SoonToBe]

Much to share and as usual, not much time on a Monday.

We talked quite a lot over the weekend, some answers were reached including some that may address/answer questions here.

I suppose rather than lengthy details right now, it would be easier to get the main things out in the open here. So, to the answer of going-back or turning-back which came up, Sue laughed and answered that there's no way to "un-fuck me" so there's no going back. As part of that discussion she said what she'd already said, that she feels she will always have a lover in the future and that unless I had some big objection to it, which she thought I wouldn't, that it was just how it's going to be. And she said that she enjoyed sex with other guys and that she didn't think it was something she would have to give up.

We talked about her issues - she told me and confirmed what I'd only heard implied/inferred - that it's her own doing that she never felt she should or could tell me no if I was horny and she knew about it. She says once she became a wife and mom, that she says she just felt she should make sure I was always satisfied, yes, even if she wasn't totally in the mood for it. She assured me that this was totally her doing and that I shouldn't feel responsible for "being a man". Thing is, she made it clear that this most definitely followed into when she started with other guys and we talked about it for a while. She says she knew how it turned me on that she was with Brad or Don or whoever and that she recognized that I even "needed" to be with her at some of those times, but she also made it clear that she is sorry she didn't feel strong enough to tell me no and that there have been many times since then that she gave-into sex with me when she would have rather not. Again she added that as with before we started with other guys - she emphasized that she loved sex with me and that I did make her cum like crazy - that it was never that I didn't "leave me breathless", it's just that now she says she has a bit of sadness that she didn't more fully enjoy the times she could have - and yes, as she is now. At one point she even said that she would relent on seeing or feeling my hard cock thinking that I must have needed her. What she continued to say was that what she's doing with me on Thursdays, letting me see her and share her excitement but that being it, she says that, "plus you jerking off so much" is helping her get past the inbred instinct to want to let me have her whenever I'm horny. She said that she hoped that in the next few weeks that she'd be to the point where I could touch her a little bit and that it would be okay - yes - as she had started with her breasts and letting me undress her the other day.

Obviously my beta-desires came up interleaved in here. She told me how she didn't understand it at first but now she does and she says that it's something we needed to talk about. Before we even talked about me, she told me that she feels things changed for her when she was seeing Robert. She said that he was the first one who she really felt like she was having sex with and not the other way around. She said that some of the way I behaved too caught her off guard, my acceptance of her lover and her desires with him without my ever meeting him or even having an opinion on. She said it was the first time she recognized what she felt and said that she'd felt it with the other before him but hadn't recognized it. She said that she hoped it didn't hurt to hear it but she really got into sex with Robert to the point where she admitted she wanted it with him more than with me. She further said that when I agreed to use condoms with her that she couldn't understand it and that it took her a while to accept that I was okay with it. What she also said was that she was sorry that didn't happen sooner with him where she felt mentally like she could give herself fully to him. She scared me a bit when she said that "had I been able to, I might have even given him his baby" but then added that "I just mean that's how I felt like I could finally be with him". She said that when I agreed to use condoms with her, that she felt it really escalated things with Robert and that it was what made her realize she just wanted/needed this kind of sex instead of her whole affair she'd previously wanted.

So, that led me to ask what that meant for me and for us now with Paul and I re-asked about sex with me. She was quiet for a bit and then asked me about how I was feeling. I told her that for now, it was okay and that it was kind of strange that it wasn't more anxious for me. She smiled and she said "you know, I understand if something like this turns you on" and she said that she's come to understand from her denying me, how arousing it can be. She looked at me and said that she was horny for me and that she did miss being with me sexually - but she said - at the same time she said she hasn't felt this horny and aroused and so wanton in a long long time. She looked at me and said she was sorry if it hurt to hear it but that right now, she is really into how it feels to just have sex with Paul. I asked if this was going to be a long-term thing and she said she didn't know but she repeated again that if it was too much for me that I should just tell her. My answer to her was that I didn't want to force myself on her if she didn't want it with me and threw back at her the whole "how I'm feeling" thing. She said she didn't mean it that way exactly and said that for right now, which means just the immediate future, that she is really enjoying everything we're doing, yes, including denying me.

I guess I was looking a bit concerned at that point because she came over to me and hugged me and said that it isn't going to be forever that she wants this with Paul and she assured me that before the summer is over, that "you and I will be having sex again". She asked me if I was still enjoying it, why was I so concerned. I told her that I wasn't happy with the uncertainty and that I at least needed to know how and what she was thinking regarding me and us. She told me that she was being honest about wanting to "reset how she feels towards me sexually" and that she wanted this to be good for me. She asked about my beta-desires and whether they were being satisfied and whether they were still there, growing, shrinking, etc. She looked at me and said "it's okay if it turns you on to not have sex with me, I understand it a lot better now" and she said that if it's what still turns me on for now, then I should enjoy it and just go with it. She said if it's changing, then I should tell her and then we can talk about it.

I was honest with her and I told her that I wasn't sure what I wanted other than that I was still feeling very turned on now. She asked me why I was feeling so anxious and I sort of told her that I wasn't sure what I wanted in the future. She looked at me and said that she would understand if I wanted to ease off on it in the future and stuff like that. I looked at her and asked her what she wanted and how everything would play out in her vision.

She told me "as I said, I think I will always want to be able to be with another man" and she said she hoped there was no question about that. I nodded and said I knew that. She continued and said that she didn't expect this current intensity to continue with Paul for that much longer. Indeed when the kids are home in another 2 1/2 weeks or so, that things are going to change with him in terms of when and how often they are together - but she giggled and said "we'll find a way". But the look on my face must have given it away because she said "okay, about you and me". She looked at me and said that "you haven't cum in me in over 4 months now" and after a pause she said "it turns me on to think about that, as your wife, that you haven't cum in me in so long..... And now, it's been over a month since I've felt you at all....". I think she saw that I wasn't breathing as she was saying that and she held my hand and she said "I know you may or may not want to hear this, but I am enjoying it right now" and she said that she is enjoying the way it is making us feel and how we are together and that she said "maybe denying you is good for us". I told her she was making me scared and that I wasn't sure I was okay with what it sounded like she was saying. She looked at me and said that she'd already told me that we'll surely be having sex again later this year. I told her that sounded uncertain and she looked at me and said "that would depend on you, and what you wanted". At that point she moved over closer to me and hugged me and said again "it's okay if this stuff turns you on baby" and she said "if you still wanted some denial, then, I was thinking, maybe......". I looked up at her and said "maybe what?" she smiled and "maybe you'd only have me sometimes, like once a month or so? ..... how would that be?". I hugged her and told her I was sure we would work something out and I guess she recognized my relief. She smiled at me and said I was being silly and that she loved me and that "of course we'll work something out". She giggled and said "maybe I'll just keep you in condoms, you'd probably like that?". I am sure I smiled but I didn't say anything.

There was more that I am sure I've glossed over or missed totally - but it took me since 10am to get this penned so I'm clicking submit for now and will add to or proofread later.

 

[SoonToBe]

So Raks - yes, things have changed - I guess permanently - but not from Paul, but actually it seems, it was her time with Robert that made the most marked change. But I guess I too have changed. I wouldn't have admitted it in the past and it seems crazy but I am enjoying her denying me. I won't say I'm prepared to give her up ad-infinitum - but at the same time, I am preparing myself mentally that things will likely be different in the future. If nothing else than limits and controls on when we will have sex together, but likely, that her foreshadowing now for several years about condom use may continue.

What I don't feel is the gloom-and-doom. If anything, our talk made me feel much more confident and comfortable in our relationship. It felt good to tell her that I was turned on by her denial and that it was turning me on. She, whether I conveyed it or not, still loves me very much. What I neglected to add is that in addition to admitting she loves the sex with Paul, she did say that she doesn't love him and isn't looking for anything more with him. If anything, it sounded very symbiotic between them and she did indicate that he does leave her very satisfied - almost enough to last her till their next time. And, I suppose as evidence bears out, that she will take to her own hands if she isn't satisfied. But back to the absence of the gloom-and-doom, if anything she all but told me that things are likely to diminish with Paul by later this summer or early fall. That combined with her thoughts towards resuming sexual contact with me, seems to support my earlier thoughts, albeit with some sort of remaining denial play.

 

[SoonToBe]

I'll add that we just finished talking about tomorrow and yes, she plans on going to Paul's same as last week. She reminded me that she has this week and next and I somewhat reluctantly agreed - as I told her that despite being turned on, it was beginning to feel uncomfortable. However, she also told me that if I wanted to join her over at Pauls for tomorrow night, she said that I had "earned that" for being so wonderful these past few weeks.

 

[raksdeer]

She said that she's come to understand from her denying me, how arousing it can be. She looked at me and said that she was horny for me and that she did miss being with me sexually - but she said - at the same time she said she hasn't felt this horny and aroused and so wanton in a long long time. .

Wanton for whom? Not for you (You seem to be source of pressure and her lovers seem to be source of pleasure...Strange but true...)

She looked at me and said she was sorry if it hurt to hear it but that right now, she is really into how it feels to just have sex with Paul.

See that is the real reason...and not the "pressure"

I asked if this was going to be a long-term thing and she said she didn't know but she repeated again that if it was too much for me that I should just tell her.My answer to her was that I didn't want to force myself on her if she didn't want it with me and threw back at her the whole "how I'm feeling" thing. She said she didn't mean it that way exactly and said that for right now, which means just the immediate future, that she is really enjoying everything we're doing, yes, including denying me.

She is enjoying denying you. Accept it. That's why she is doing it and not for some weird reason of pressure. And she goes on to say "if it's too much for you you should tell her". That even you asked for end point should have meant left her concerned. That it didn't, speaks of the change (Read damage) both of you have done to your relationship.

She told me that she was being honest about wanting to "reset how she feels towards me sexually" and that she wanted this to be good for me. She asked about my beta-desires and whether they were being satisfied and whether they were still there, growing, shrinking, etc. She looked at me and said "it's okay if it turns you on to not have sex with me, I understand it a lot better now" and she said that if it's what still turns me on for now, then I should enjoy it and just go with it. She said if it's changing, then I should tell her and then we can talk about it.

She is saying the right things here, but do we hear her wish somehow that you must continue to remain beta....."if it's so good for you why are you concerned". In essence you have lost her...may be not completely, but you have certainly lost a place of her "Main man" in her life as far as sex is concerned. May be not in other areas....but let me ask you what is the most dominant, most emotionally stirring thing of your life right now....? If you are not there it's time to accept that you lost...!!!!

But the look on my face must have given it away because she said "okay, about you and me". She looked at me and said that "you haven't cum in me in over 4 months now" and after a pause she said "it turns me on to think about that, as your wife, that you haven't cum in me in so long..... And now, it's been over a month since I've felt you at all....". I think she saw that I wasn't breathing as she was saying that and she held my hand and she said "I know you may or may not want to hear this, but I am enjoying it right now" and she said that she is enjoying the way it is making us feel and how we are together and that she said "maybe denying you is good for us". .

So whether you want to hear it or not, it is there. And she is enjoying the way it's making her feel.....!!! May be Peak is right when he says that "Unless you cracked completely, even if you said you didn’t want to be denied, the best you would get at the moment would be condom fucks on days well away from her ‘Paul’ time. ". So it's no more a matter of your choice. Would you call this relationship a loving relationship amongst equals....?

And then she reinforces that by throwing you a bone...

I told her she was making me scared and that I wasn't sure I was okay with what it sounded like she was saying. She looked at me and said that she'd already told me that we'll surely be having sex again later this year. I told her that sounded uncertain and she looked at me and said "that would depend on you, and what you wanted". At that point she moved over closer to me and hugged me and said again "it's okay if this stuff turns you on baby" and she said "if you still wanted some denial, then, I was thinking, maybe......". I looked up at her and said "maybe what?" she smiled and "maybe you'd only have me sometimes, like once a month or so? ..... how would that be?".

And finally...Suppose you go back to using condoms with her...where is all that reset happening? You seducing her and all that..what it was all about...Was it all just a cover-up to lead you to this stage? I wonder...I really wonder....!

Before it goes south for you..STB (and I am really worried) please check who she is getting advise from? I am sorry if my words carry the "Gloom and Doom" for you. But it's what I, as a third person, perceive from your words. If You permit, than please take a word of advise from me...Never agree to get back to condoms completely....unless you want to loose her completely. You statement " I won't say I'm prepared to give her up ad-infinitum - but at the same time, I am preparing myself mentally that things will likely be different in the future. If nothing else than limits and controls on when we will have sex together, but likely, that her foreshadowing now for several years about condom use may continue. " also says that you didn't perceive this and it's as if she is forcing the nature of you relationship to change. Don't allow that. Be conscious of what you are doing and choosing.

Stay Happy!!!

 

[wingman]

STB. U are in the actual convo's, and know best of course, but from what I'm reading here ur overthinking this. If I recall correctly, u got her into this. She is making sure ur fantasies are covered, and she has said it ends when u say the word. Don't underestimate the attraction u and the kids have on her!
A while back u seemed to be really into the lover/denial thing. While u seem to be feeling like u wanta pull back, I propose now is the time to take a quick peek at the next level. U have a perfect pullback point (the kids coming home), a Bo who doesn't hound her for more time, and her.... Ur horny little minx!
U have the perfect chance to push boundaries even further, feel that cuck angst to the max, and take a slowdown period to catch ur breath and see if it's what u like.
Let her spend 3,4,5 days this next 2 weeks and see what u like, don't like. While he isn't asking for that, I'm sure Paul would jump at the chance to have her that much for 2 weeks. In 2 weeks, the kids ratchet it back, and u guys talk through how it felt.

Just a thought.

 

[golfman2315]

Just a couple observations.

You have mentioned that you thought Sue was getting guidance from her pen pals. Does she tell you what they say or have you read what they have said?

While Sue clearly expresses her desire for all the sex she is getting from Paul now and from potential future lovers yet it still reads to me like she is pushing the denial angles based on what she thinks you want. She said some time back that you would not get her again until she wanted it yet she has admitted several times that she was horny and would have like to have had yet she didn't. Why not?

It seems like the recap of the Tuesday and Wednesday nights are little more than two nights of sex to fill her desire but if you assume Sue roughly spends 12 hours a night there and 24 over two that they must have something more in common and that would be a little concerning to me. That's a lot of time to spend with someone you once said you didn't always like.

To me it seems like she has asked you many times if certain things are what you want and you have kind of prepped us with your prior thoughts that you wanted to say no but always nod yes or swallow hard and say yes and the train progresses further down the tracks. Just remember it takes a lot track to stop a train.

Hopefully this all turns out the way both you and Sue want but for right now it seems like one party is getting what they want and the other not so much.