New Year, New Thread

[SoonToBe]

Raks - yes, as I said, it did sting a little bit to hear her say she wanted to share the weekend with Paul when she'd said it would be mine. But in reality, I just really want some alone time with her and if Paul leaves early enough on Saturday, I'll still have both days with her and hopefully she'll want me both days. I think that is part of what she wants - to give me Saturday night after he leaves, in a way, to give me a chance at something similar to last weekend - at least that's the way I took it.

But you are right - in my cuckold-heart I did love to hear her admit her preference for Paul. I don't say that lightly because it really does both tweak my cuckold heart - but it also represents a real change in her that she is admitting to more and more. It turns me on that in a way, her pussy itches for him. But what I don't feel is any threat here. They may have been all over each other and had more sex in 2 days than she and I have had in 2 months, but what I didn't feel was an overflowing of emotions or anything like that between them. Yes - I am sure I heard the L word when she was crying out in pleasure with him - at least it sounded that way through the walls - but that's all and she's long told me that she says that whenever she feels it in reference to how she feels - and she admits it - she does love fucking him.

I hope that helps explain my mindset. Right now, even after quite an intense workout last night, I can already feel my ardor rising and the heaviness in my balls that will only grow between now and the weekend.

Let me run.

 

[raksdeer]

STB, it's not question of what you want. I was just wondering if Sue could push aside her commitment to you this coming weekend, then I think, she has already given a huge part of her to Paul. And she wanted a full night. It's only after you whined that she relented and as you narrated I don't think she asked you about it. Even peakmb had said before you left for the trip that "there is a reward at the end of trip". I think you will have to forget about the reward for now.

And now, even the bigger question is how do you believe what she will say or promise in future? Even if she says she will come back to you if you were not beta...how do you know that she would stand by what she said. Her desire, her want and her connection with Paul is too great and holds magic as you must have seen during the weekend. Probably she took you on weekend with her and Paul to witness firsthand how it would be in future and say if you had any objections to it. She is testing you and getting you to accede to her wants and desires.

As for her wanting you on both days - I remember STB, that you asked Sue once, if she would want you sometimes - that's really in her hands isn't it? If her wanting you, has to be at your behest, your request, that it's not really wanting you, it's just throwing you a bone as peak would say it. I really wonder if she wants you anymore. Given a choice, I think she would not want to be with you at all. As evident by incidents of you peeking into toilet (when she said she does not wants to be sexy with you), this weekend wherein she didn't even threw a bone at you, and then replacing you with Paul this weekend, it is clear who she is wanting right now..in her bed and probably in her heart too.

I guess cuckoldry is not only about relinquishing your mating rights, it's also about relinquishing the need to be cared, wanted, loved and respected. I sincerely wish that atleast for once, just for the sake of trial, you become alpha for a week or a fortnight, just to see if Sue can go back. I don't think she would. I don't think she could.

 

[golfman2315]

Steve you have to admit that the ski weekend was a complete 180 from the original plan to reward you by giving you a blowjob over the weekend for you allowing her and Paul to be the couple. Then you were to have your turn after the weekend to now Paul will get another session before you finally get yours. Maybe she will make you wait even longer?

I am kind of surprised that things always seem to be a moving target. Over the summer you guys decided that you really needed some re-connection weekends and I think that might have lasted just one time and then she pushed hard for you to participate with her and Paul and that seems to have been scrapped now.

I don't get the feeling that you will every pump the brakes and slow things down but I do wonder if Sue will be able to sense when to pull back a little and reconnect with you for the sake of some balance. I really felt like through your whole journey these last 7 or 8 years now that the best balance and groove the two of you have ever been in was between Thanksgiving and the week before this trip. Your recap and entries almost glowed of the connection you to were having so to me that is why this turn is pretty surprising.

Not trying to criticize just pointing out some observations and if everything that is happening as you want them to then more power to you.

 

[SquirmingSub]

Steve,

As others here I appreciate your continued updates with such details, allowing all of us to know how you feel and felt about this past weekend and the conversations which has followed.

I hesitate to say this although many others within this group already know my general view points when it comes to mutually agreeable relationships. Most others have cautioned you, in some cases question why this works for you and some even in their own way seem to want to through Sue under the proverbial bus for doing something that you both seem to enjoy. Over this past year the overall relationship has truly evolved, you and Sue have entered another chapter and it is something that you both seem to desire. With that said, only you know what works for you, what works for Sue and what works for both of you as a couple.

As always thank you for sharing so openly and enjoy the journey in which you are on.

 

[peakmb]

Maybe not a perfect storm but certainly a beautiful little storm in a teacup over this weekend. I'd really like to see you get out of this one Steve!

 

[azsurfer77]

STB; you have written about Saturday, but I assume that the three of you arrived at the ski resort Friday evening, that Sue and Paul shared the bedroom Friday night as well as Saturday, and that you checked out, skied, and drove home Sunday. Did anything happen Friday evening to give you a foretaste of the rest of the weekend, or was it so late that you all just crashed. Did anything happen Sunday morning that topped the weekend off?

I ask because it was a long weekend for you and I wonder how you took the whole weekend. I know the Sunday evening report you made had everybody wondering if it was too tough on you psychologically, yet your recounting of Saturday seemed to say you really enjoyed the time spent last weekend.

Then the promise by Sue to give you this weekend without Paul, only to about-face and tell you that she was spending Wednesday evening with Paul. When that didn't work out, Sue told you she was inviting Paul to spend Saturday evening, then Saturday night and Sunday with you.

I sense that Sue and you really love each other, and Sue is doing this for you, as well as herself, and really taking on the leadership role in the whole triangle relationship, but I have to wonder about what Sue's motives are for telling you one thing and then doing another. I also wrote in the distant past that it seemed Sue was giving you a chance to renounce being the beta, and taking the alpha role back over. That seems to have gone by the wayside now, and like some of your other faithful readers, I think Sue controls the situation from now until forever. I have read a lot about reconnections, but yours seem to be getting farther and farther apart, and though I don't believe Sue would cut you off forever, because she still seems to love you, she seems to emasculate you very easily, then turn on the charm to keep you happy.

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
On any objective measure of a thirty year old marriage you are still getting more sexual content with Sue than the norm. So why are so many people thinking you are hard done by at the moment. Is it because Sue is playing the Lucy to your Charlie Brown with the sexual football? Jerking your chain in a cruel, uncaring way?
Maybe you need to look down the other end of the telescope for a moment. Maybe Sue wants sex with Alpha Steve once in a while. At the moment beta Steve is always deferring, always passing up half chances. He's the dog sniffing the bone but not taking it. Maybe that's why Sue gave you the vouchers. To use them you have say, Me Now. For that moment you have to be the Alpha. Perhaps Sue is giving you your way back.

 

[SoonToBe]

Well, I mentioned a lot of what everyone has said here - about how this was supposed to be my weekend.
It's led to a bit of an argument - she's considering telling him to not come here today while we sort this all out.

 

[peakmb]

That's a good thing Steve. I don't know what the female equivalent of thinking with your little brain is, but I do think Sue has been guilty of it lately. She should know you well enough by now to understand that you have never actually tried to stop her to date. That your acquiescence in matters sexual is therefore not quite the same thing as your wholehearted agreement. Even I know that by now so surely she does. Even if Paul ends up coming over I suspect it wouldn't be the same so Sue should cancel it and for that reason you should urge her to do so. You also might not get the sex you might have got but the discussion is worth more in the long term.

 

[raksdeer]

I totally support Peak and you. And thank god for that. A commitment is a commitment. Period. When you do not honor it, the trust goes away. Without trust there is no relationship. And I disagree with Peak....when he says "You might not get the sex you might". Here the question is far bigger than the sex. Sex this week is what she committed. Had you been in a regular relationship it would have been ok when wives don't feel like it and get a day off or so...but when she plans for a weekend away with her lover then she can do it for you. Sue owes you bigtime buddy. I understand that both of you love each other to death, but sometimes a powerplay puts things into balance. My best wishes STB.!!!

I also believe that this is not Sue...this must be whosoever is coaching her on internet or her penpal. It's time to get things in open and discuss the issues you two are having

 

[manon]

Steve,

I have previously suggested balance like exclusive only access with Sue one full week every few weeks.

Balance is nature as balance in everything greatly helps keep all parts in check and probably would have greatly prevented what you are going thru now and what may manifest in the future.

This is not a got you but rather a "suggestion" on a path between you two going forward.

At times like this the cheer leading fans fall silent and await the potential negative outcome with secret glee. I as well as Raks, Peak and a few others do not.

I hope you both find your way thru this, pull it back some to a balanced approach going forward for the best chance for continued fun for the long term.

Regards.

 

[SoonToBe]

Again only have a few moments now. Okay, I caved and he is on his way over now, but he's not staying long and I'm actually going to be going out and doing some stuff while he's here. She admitted to me that she wants to fuck him today and said that in her mind, she thought it would have been something I'd have wanted to maybe be here when he was here and that she thought I would want to be with her later tonight after he left. I told her that it would have been a whole lot nicer if she'd asked me or checked with me before assuming things.

A part of our talk was a bit sobering as she again said that she does actually prefer sex with him right now vs. me using a condom with her and she asked me if that wasn't what I'd been telling her and asking her for with my whole 'beta thing'. I told her yes, and that it really was more the sudden unannounced change in plans that seemed disrespectful to me. She smiled and said that I was right and that hadn't been nice and that was when she said what I said above.

Part of what we talked about was her really getting into the groove with Paul after last weekend and she said she hoped it didn't hurt me to hear it but that she would rather have sex with him than me. Thing that stung was that she said again that this is what I'd asked her to do and want and that I should maybe have thought about it all. But she did hug me and said that she understood that I"d gotten my hopes up and was maybe expecting something that she felt bad about.

Anyway - he's due here by about 5:30pm and when I agreed to it I told her that I hoped he didn't hang out too long but at the same time I am sure he's not just going to come here for a quickie. She kissed me and promised me that she just wanted him for just a little while and then told me she'll make sure she makes up for it later.

The fact that I got an apology and an "I understand" I think went a lot of the way in my head and I think she really understood so I'm letting her get showered and dressed up a bit while I"m typing ths and then I'm going to head over buddy's house for a while. Before she went into the shower she pulled my pants and underwear down and went down on me for a bit and she smiled at how hard I got how quickly and she smiled and said I should just relax about everything and enjoy what she has in store for me.

 

[peakmb]

Good luck Steve. I'll be honest, my head would more into a good talk than a good fuck tonight, and I can't really see Sue being all fired up for you either given her comments earlier. I really think you both need some time out of the game just to get your emotional balance again. No Paul, no sex for either of you. A detox for the mind. Press reset and then carry on in whatever direction you both agree on. If Paul has any sensitivity he'll pick up on it tonight. If he hasn't, well that's it's own message. I don't think it's the end but with your inability to say No to anything Sue wants, she needs to reassess how to get informed consent out of you. Plus she really needs to stick to her promises, even if she might find more pleasure at that moment doing something else. Sub/Dom or straight, it's still a partnership you have.

 

[raksdeer]

Even after your displeasure, she is inviting him. Are these signs of love and great communication. Are these signs of intimacy Squirm? You have said previously that Sue would listen if you need something and you could put a stop to things when you want it. Not any more, it seems. I am really wondering what has gotten into Sue.

 

[SquirmingSub]

Steve,

Honest and Open Communication is always the KEY to any relationship no matter the type or dynamic the couple has chosen for themselves. With that said, this honest and open communication must also be done in a manner that the respectful of the other person and the relationship as a whole, it is all about the approach we take.

Well, I mentioned a lot of what everyone has said here - about how this was supposed to be my weekend.
It's led to a bit of an argument - she's considering telling him to not come here today while we sort this all out.

None of us were there with you, so it would be presumptuous for any of us to truly say that we understand the root of the argument in which you had with Sue. Yes we can all make assumptions as to the reason although it could be said that it was about the adjustments to the weekend plans by Sue without consulting you in advance, it could be said that maybe the argument was a result of the approach with her during the respective conversation. Again, none of us really know except for you and Sue.

As you already know, there are a few different viewpoints and I have refrained from saying anything over the last few days which could be viewed as in conflict of the other recommendations in which you have been receiving from those that truly are not OK with your exploration into this lifestyle choice in which you and Sue made together. Most everyone here still seem to see you and Sue as being in a typical “Hotwife” relationship were you still have a role as the alpha within the relationship. The reality is, you have come full circle during your relationship (pre-marriage & during your marriage) with Sue and based on your post over the last 18+/- months you have made it clear to Sue that you wanted to be her beta man, the beta within the relationship when it comes to the sexual aspects of the marriage. As you noticed Sue has become the alpha within the marriage (this is what you requested) when it comes to the bedroom. What you have also noticed is that as Sue has become much more comfortable within her new role as the alpha, Sue has also allowed herself to become much more open with both you and Paul about her physical desires.

A part of our talk was a bit sobering as she again said that she does actually prefer sex with him right now vs. me using a condom with her and she asked me if that wasn't what I'd been telling her and asking her for with my whole 'beta thing'. I told her yes, and that it really was more the sudden unannounced change in plans that seemed disrespectful to me. She smiled and said that I was right and that hadn't been nice and that was when she said what I said above.

It should be expected that Sue would be exploring the limitations of the boundaries, it should also be expected that over time that an alpha woman would become more sexually drawn to another alpha or equal in the bedroom. When this happens, the beta man (in this case YOU) will indeed become even more restricted when it comes to intercourse. Before everyone jumps on that remark, this is something that you (Steve) requested by seeking to become Sue’s beta. You have told Sue that this is what YOU wanted and yes Sue continues grow as a person and your relationship continues to evolve. Sue has been open with you and confirmed that she did have some feelings for Paul and no those feelings are not the same as she has with you.

You and Sue have a bond that many marriages cannot say that they have, you have been married for more years than most and you both have opened a new chapter that you both seem to be enjoying overall with a few hiccups. I am sure you know that Sue will never replace you as her life partner, as her husband or as her lover in every way with the exception of Paul becoming her primary sexual partner. In so many ways you yourself have encouraged, supported and even requested that Sue restrict your access to her body on multiple levels as she became exclusive to Paul when it come to bare intercourse. Unlike an alpha man married to a “hotwife”, you asked to be a beta man married to a “hotwife” and with that Sue has become the alpha. Sue has slowly yet steadily become more confident, more comfortable within the role and in turn has requested more of you when it comes to the evolution in the lifestyle in which you both agreed to fully explore together as a couple.

If you are now having second thoughts and feel as some others on this forum feel, it may be time for you to sit back, evaluate the overall arrangement. This is something I would do without bringing it up to Sue until you know with some certainty of the direction you would like the relationship to take if different than the current direction. Once you are sure of what you truly need and or truly would like for yourself and as a couple, then you should set a date night were both of you have an extended amount of time to get away and talk about everything in a non-sexual environment. This all comes back around to honest and open communication with each other without either of you passing judgment onto each other.

Even after your displeasure, she is inviting him. Are these signs of love and great communication. Are these signs of intimacy Squirm? You have said previously that Sue would listen if you need something and you could put a stop to things when you want it. Not any more, it seems. I am really wondering what has gotten into Sue.

Rak as to your question, this would really get down to what Steve truly considers displeasure and how offended was he by Sue changing up the plans for this weekend. Sue may have been understand the impression as the alpha within the relationship that she had the ability/right to be able to make adjustments or changes to the weekend schedule without consulting Steve in advance. We all need to remember that Steve did in his own way request this relationship dynamic in the bedroom although the more alpha Sue becomes sexually, the more her confident dominate side will begin to show outside of the bedroom, outside of the sexual side of the relationship. This is something that I have a feeling that Steve has not expected to happen. I have always said that no matter the couple, no matter the relationship model, a couple should always have honest and open communication. In this case, I have a feeling that Sue has slowly been taking the next step within the relationship and Steve has not yet fully relived, accepted or embraced the direction Sue is heading and this is something that they both should discuss without their conversation being colored by any of us here on this forum. As to your direct question about intimacy, I have always said that there are many ways that a couple can develop and maintain intimacy far beyond the sexual intimacy shared by bare intercourse only.

I am sure that we all will find the future updates by Steve to be informative and ideally in a positive direction for both Sue and Steve. Only they know what will work for them in the short and long term.

Have a good night all.

 

[raksdeer]

Rak as to your question, this would really get down to what Steve truly considers displeasure and how offended was he by Sue changing up the plans for this weekend. Sue may have been understand the impression as the alpha within the relationship that she had the ability/right to be able to make adjustments or changes to the weekend schedule without consulting Steve in advance. We all need to remember that Steve did in his own way request this relationship dynamic in the bedroom although the more alpha Sue becomes sexually, the more her confident dominate side will begin to show outside of the bedroom, outside of the sexual side of the relationship. This is something that I have a feeling that Steve has not expected to happen. I have always said that no matter the couple, no matter the relationship model, a couple should always have honest and open communication. In this case, I have a feeling that Sue has slowly been taking the next step within the relationship and Steve has not yet fully relived, accepted or embraced the direction Sue is heading and this is something that they both should discuss without their conversation being colored by any of us here on this forum. As to your direct question about intimacy, I have always said that there are many ways that a couple can develop and maintain intimacy far beyond the sexual intimacy shared by bare intercourse only.
Have a good night all.

Sorry Squirm...I don't agree with you there. I was not only referring to Sexual intimacy. I was referring to intimacy where two persons in a relationship were truthful and honest with each other. When one of the person in the relationship is not truthful and honest and does not stands by her / his committeemen would you still call that relationship intimate? Would you still call a relationship intimate if people do not understand each other's need and cater to them. Of course "there are many ways that a couple can develop and maintain intimacy far beyond the sexual intimacy shared by bare intercourse only.", yes...but then these couples are honest with each other....if it's a sexual intimacy well one can be dominant and other submissive, but as far as the kind of intimacy you are suggesting - both need be on an equal ground. On hand you seem to be advocating (and you have cheered Steve all along) to submit to Sue and this will result in greater intimacy, on other hand you say that She has rights to take decisions without informing Steve? Is that a sign of a loving couple? if you still yes to all this, then we know where you stand and how false and flimsy you sound. I urge you to please understand this rationally rather than through colored lenses of cuckoldry. I am not saying that you are a false cuckold, but those who don't have any such experience and still cheer on Steve (and coach Sue) and doing the biggest harm to their relationship.

 

[raksdeer]

Steve,

Honest and Open Communication is always the KEY to any relationship no matter the type or dynamic the couple has chosen for themselves. With that said, this honest and open communication must also be done in a manner that the respectful of the other person and the relationship as a whole, it is all about the approach we take.

Sure ..So Squirm according to you the communication between STB and Sue has been honest off late ? And STB, I am not judging either you or Sue, but this is about assertions that Squirm seem to make.

Steve,
The reality is, you have come full circle during your relationship (pre-marriage & during your marriage) with Sue and based on your post over the last 18+/- months you have made it clear to Sue that you wanted to be her beta man, the beta within the relationship when it comes to the sexual aspects of the marriage. As you noticed Sue has become the alpha within the marriage (this is what you requested) when it comes to the bedroom. What you have also noticed is that as Sue has become much more comfortable within her new role as the alpha, Sue has also allowed herself to become much more open with both you and Paul about her physical desires.

No points of conflict there. But is STB beta in Sexual side of relationship only? or Beta in even deciding when he wants to be with his wife ?

It should be expected that Sue would be exploring the limitations of the boundaries, it should also be expected that over time that an alpha woman would become more sexually drawn to another alpha or equal in the bedroom. When this happens, the beta man (in this case YOU) will indeed become even more restricted when it comes to intercourse. Before everyone jumps on that remark, this is something that you (Steve) requested by seeking to become Sue’s beta. You have told Sue that this is what YOU wanted and yes Sue continues grow as a person and your relationship continues to evolve. Sue has been open with you and confirmed that she did have some feelings for Paul and no those feelings are not the same as she has with you.

Bang on point. She does have some feelings for Paul that she no longer feels for STB. What was surprising to me was her asking for privacy when she was pissing in toilet. That should have been a warning sign for STB. But now a days he tends to listen more aptly to smaller head than the bigger one. If a husband cannot have that kind of intimacy with his wife then....I don't know..what intimacy you were telling us about?

I am sure you know that Sue will never replace you as her life partner, as her husband or as her lover in every way with the exception of Paul becoming her primary sexual partner. In so many ways you yourself have encouraged, supported and even requested that Sue restrict your access to her body on multiple levels as she became exclusive to Paul when it come to bare intercourse. Unlike an alpha man married to a “hotwife”, you asked to be a beta man married to a “hotwife” and with that Sue has become the alpha. Sue has slowly yet steadily become more confident, more comfortable within the role and in turn has requested more of you when it comes to the evolution in the lifestyle in which you both agreed to fully explore together as a couple.

I hope you understand the difference between request and command and pushing one's own agenda. And this is not evolution. It's destruction my dear Sir. And when you say "both agreed to fully explore as a couple" do you mean a sub and dom couple wherein sub does accede to whatever dom says? or a normal couple wherein they could together decide where they want to go? It seems they are no more an equal couple. Sue has turned into a dom and cruel one at that. And STB, with due respect you have not only become beta in bedroom but outside as well.

My only request to you Squirm is don't guide STB and other cucks with your misguided principles and thoughts. You would do a lot of good.

 

[peakmb]

Guys,
Steve is now halfway through perhaps the two most important days in his relationship with Sue of the last six months. He clearly saw he has a problem (well eventually) and acted to correct it. If he had said something to Sue as soon as she mentioned Paul being there it would been better as he may never have known. Now he does and how that affects the dynamic has yet to play out and Steve has few ways to influence it. Sue must have explained it somehow but Paul must be a bit more apprehensive than before of his position and of Steve's approval of it.
Squirmy, I don't think it helps to continue to see Steve in your mould and as if he himself didn't think he had a problem. We can all debate the gravitas of it in his mind but to brush it off is unrealistic.
On the other hand, neither is the sky falling in.
Hopefully both of them can do some fundamental talking today and steady the ship a bit. It needs to trim the sails a bit and some agreed course correction but I can't see it turning about just yet.

 

[raksdeer]

Peak, while you are right, you often tend to Sugar coat things. On one hand you say - "Steve is now halfway through perhaps the two most important days in his relationship with Sue of the last six months" and on other hand you also say "neither is the sky falling in". Sue's diminishing love for Steve has been evident since quite some time. May be it's to bring out Steve from his self imposed cuckoldry, as you have been indicating, or may be Steve has unleashed a monster. We don't know. What we know however has STB has been loosing respect of his beloved wife as a man. One other thing that you have been also pointing out since quite some time is that Sue often uses Wednesday nights (the night of STB's angst, his on edge) as a time to usher in more control and has used it to her advantage more often than not. While STB and Sue promised to each other that they will have serious discussions before doing anything sustentative, it seems that it is not the case anymore and if Squirm is to be believed than She need not discuss things with STB at all. Hopefully it doesn't goes the same way as the relationship that STB always wondered and fantasized about.

 

[Knk069]

Steve,
All I can say about this week's events is "DANGER WILL ROBINSON, DANGER!" My wife always says that actions speak louder than words. She has downplayed her feelings for Paul and claims she loves you. Her actions speak volumes.

I have to agree with the others that Sue has not been fair to you this week. She put you through a lot last weekend on the promise for the two of you to have a week/weekend to yourselves. Then she decides to see Paul on Wednesday but since he couldn't make it, she shafted your promised weekend. She talks about being in a groove with him, supposedly sexual groove, but that shows it is an emotional groove. Danger. One or both of them may have used last weekend to feel like a married couple in love and they do not want to give it up.

Sue was wrong to use your beta sexual desires to justify her behavior this week. I don't think you have ever shared a desire to be a beta emotionally.

I think you need to have a serious talk with her and/or Paul and stand up for your marriage. I would encourage you to tell her that she has gotten too emotionally involved with Paul and that they should disconnect totally (sex, calls, texts, etc.) for a couple weeks so that you and Sue can reestablish your marriage as the primary thing. If she tries to claim that she loves you, you could hit her with that request and she could accept and show you she loves you, or fight it and show she loves Paul more.

Paul used to thank you for sharing your wife. He stopped. Maybe he needs to be reminded of that.

Good luck Steve.