She Is His

[wockaWocka]

This is the thing. I honestly was happy to lie there with her and just feel her and to let myself enjoy my horniness without expecting - or I'll say it - without wanting her. I mean sure I would have loved to have fucked her right then - but at the same time, I know she didn't want me to and honestly, for as good as it would have been, it felt better in a way to not have her and for her to know that.

I'd call that huge progress on both your parts. You are more in tune with her and her sexual identity is all hers now and she's able to comfortably define a boundary in the moment. Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like you interpret that as a "beta" tendency, but I'd argue it isn't.

Again, just my opinion: there's an opportunity here for you to explore/express desire to her without it being PIV sex. You need to grow with your wife by expanding your own ideas of sexual identity because she's certainly expanded hers in very healing ways.

The communication you write about is a very rare and good thing. Thank you for keeping this thread going.

 

[SoonToBe]

Ahhh - the surprise. To be honest, I had forgotten about it till I saw others mention it and then I was a bit sad that it hadn't happened. I was going to say something about it but instead - she did in fact surprise me last night! We'd been drinking wine all afternoon and when the fireworks started last night that we could hear in the distance she looked at me and said that she "owed me" and then giggled and said "how about some fireworks for you tonight!". I had thought for sure I'd be masturbating with her as every other Wednesday night, but instead she said she had something else in mind.

She led me into our living room and as I stood there she dropped to her knees and undid my pants and pulled everything off from the waist down. She pushed me back onto the couch and she gave me a blowjob like I haven't had in maybe years. Maybe it was the alcohol (or maybe some guilt on her part? lol) but she sucked me like a master. One hand holding my balls while the other was in perfect time with her mouth. As I got closer she took her mouth off and said "it's okay if you know, you get into it a bit more baby" and she put her hand back around my cock in a way that I knew would let me thrust away into her mouth but keep me from going too deep and making her gag.

My god - it was sooo good. The heat and alcohol and yes, her teasing had all left me quite horny. She moaned loudly and enjoyably as I got into it and she would hold her head still and let me get into it even more. In the end though - again like a master - she edged me at least 3 or 4 times - and she took her mouth off a few times long enough to tell me, sexily I might add, how much pre-cum she could taste seeping out of me. She told me afterwards that she knew from that, that when it was time for me to cum, that I was going to cum a lot. She smiled and told me she loved knowing all that about me and how to "get you to really cum a lot". Sure enough, my god when she did keep going that next time - it felt like the back of my head exploded when I finally let go. She moaned as I could feel myself cumming in her mouth. And I clearly knew what would be next and I wasn't disappointed. With a mouthful of my cum she climbed up on my lap and we shared an intensely passionate kiss as well as shared my cum. The feeling of hugging her against me while she straddled me like that was just such a beautiful moment.

We talked in bed last night and I told her that I thought Paul should come by our place this weekend. She loved that I had thought about her and wanted to have him here with us. I told her after we'd both settled down last night that I thought she could use a "good fucking" from him. She just smiled and snuggled into bed wtih me.

 

[Curt Bruch]

Hmm, are you sure she didn't 'suck you like a Mistress' or was that some Freudian slip in your description?

 

[SoonToBe]

Lol - nice.

 

[StudCaptM]

Glad things are going well Steve, what is the plan for Paul's visit, are you going to participate? I think it may be time for you to start assisting with their coupling, insert..... do some fluffing....!?????

 

[SoonToBe]

LOL - funny. She's not into that at all. He should be here in a few hours, hard to argue with him playing golf today - incredible day out. She is off getting a manicure/pedicure. She never misses teasing me about it before she leaves.

 

[dana007]

STB
good luck and have fun tonight.
keep us posted.

 

[SoonToBe]

Well, she was in quite the horny mood by the time he got here. As I said, we had talked very openly about it and I think that she almost seemed to need to tell me ahead of time that she was "in the mood". She was getting changed after coming back from being out and I stayed and talked to her and a she pulled he panties off she smiled and looked over to me. I asked "what?" and she picked them up and walked over to me and handed them to me. The crotch in them had darkened from being damp. She asked me if I can "behave" and when I nodded yes she took my hand and guided a finger gently between her pussy lips and let me feel how wet she was before she walked away and took out a clean pair of panties to pull on. She changed into a silky camisole and then just pulled a pair of shorts on without a top.

I knew what to expect for when he arrived. When we'd talked she said that she'd like to be able to relax with Paul and "feel free" around the house and that they'd "had a lot" together (sex? time?) when they were away and she admitted to liking it. She said that with us agreeing to how sex will be between us, that she'd like to know that I'd either be accommodating to them/her, or that I'd "maybe find something to do for a while". She asked me if I wanted "to be there" later on when they went upstairs and when I nodded yes she smiled and said that since we'd talked and agreed to how things were going to go between us, that she wanted to be sure I would be okay. I didn't ask directly but asked what she meant and she said that being away with him as she'd already told me, that they had a lot more time together and that "we enjoyed that time.. you know... having fun....". So when he did arrive after dinner even I could feel that where I thought they were comfortable together before, they were even more so now. Thing was, he was really nice with me too. I don't know as we didn't talk yet, but he was definitely different towards me. I'd even say friendly.

The other thing that was different was that he, and really they were far more comfortable together sitting together on the couch or pal-ling around together. I got the feeling that they were good friends more than anything as their conversation were truly just that - normal stuff from what I could hear. Same with me. We talked about a lot of stuff while Sue was out or doing whatever as we enjoyed a glass of wine together. He shared his thoughts on the kids in the cave in Thailand and we even talked politics for a bit. Both sharing a surprising similar view on things, conservative fiscally but liberal socially. It did make me feel good to know he was the guy now enjoying my wife.

After we'd finished a bottle of wine, Sue clearly was ready for their part of the evening to start. She came back from the kitchen and instead of sitting on the couch next to Paul, she sat on his lap and gave him a far more explicit kiss than I'd seen yet (I did leave them alone for a bit when he first got here and I did learn later that as they'd kissed then, that he'd fingered her to an orgasm before coming back into the room with me) but now, this was being repeated again only in front of me. Thing is, at one point Paul looked up at me and he asked me "are you okay with us here?" and I just said "sure, it's fine if you are okay". The thing about that is that it just seemed so easy for me to say that almost without even thinking about it.

In the next few minutes Sue raised her butt and Paul slid off her shorts leaving her in the panties I'd seen her put on earlier. I just loved seeing her like that. Her hair was back over one shoulder and I could see her nipples through the silky top she had on. He kissed her with one arm around her back and the other felt her breasts - first over and then under her top. Her nipples were rock hard when he was done with them and I watched his hand lazily work it's way towards her pussy.

He had to have seen me move to get a better view a second later I could see his hand more clearly under her panties and as I watched it was clear he was again finger-fucking her. When they weren't kissing she was moaning softly and her hips would rock up and down in time with his finger and as I watched, not more than a few minutes later didn't she start to moan louder and arch her back as his fingers brought her to a rousing orgasm right in front of me. She gasped for a moment and I could see her clenching her thighs together as she felt him and I could see his fingers still in her. A moment later she pulled back from him giggling and looking towards me sitting in my chair watching them. "Give us a few minutes upstairs first honey?" was all she said as she got up from lying on him, adjusted her panties and then playfully pulled him up from our couch.

In the few minutes between then and when I followed them up all I could think about was genuinely how turned on I was but even more so, how that just felt so right to me to see him do that to her. I began to think about their time away and I am wondering just how many times she orgasmed from him that weekend as opposed to with him. The thought that filled my head next was that I so wanted to go right up and see her but at the same time I knew she'd asked for a little time. Those few minutes took the longest to go by.

 

[SoonToBe]

I could probably write a whole page full of the feelings I had watching them together. Seeing him eagerly licking away at her pussy when I came to the doorway was just beautiful - but even more so was that she was holding her legs back for him and she had them pulled wide apart. She didn't see me, her eyes were closed and her head rocked back and forth softly almost in time with his licking. She moaned softly and even put one hand on his head at one point. Again she lay back and literally let her make her cum. It was only after she'd calmed down and he'd moved up and was sucking at her breasts that she looked up and saw me and smiled.

Paul turned around and saw me and said "hey" but that was all before he turned back to kissing her and sucking her breasts. A moment later she seemed to motion to him and he got off the bed and stood at the side of it facing me with his cock standing hard. She lay back and in a new thing for them, he almost seemed to straddle her head kneeling with one knee while she sucked his cock. Her legs stayed spread lewdly apart and as I stood there - he made his fingers feel quite at home inside my wife. I could tell he arched his fingertips to reach her g-spot as she moaned loudly each time and seemed to shake and quiver. He did look up at me at one point and when he saw me watching he again smiled and put one hand gently against the back of her head and with the other - he reached down and spread her pussy gaping open to show me just how aroused and wet she was. When he pulled her fingers out and gently rubbed her clit she rocked her hips back and forth and upwards to try to make more contact - until a moment later he would push 2 and then 3 fingers into her making her moan loudly.

I was surprised as she was really into sucking him including taking his cock out of her mouth and stroking it deep and hard and then sexily licking at what was dripping out of him (and me) by that point. She's normally not terribly into sucking cock but this time I have to say she looked genuinely passionate doing it - and in my head it surely answered about her newfound skills sucking my cock!

So - whereas they had used to get into fucking pretty soon - this went on for quite a while with Paul slowly getting more and more into it to where I started to see what was happening. He slowly started going from her sucking him to him fucking her mouth. At the same time it was obvious her pussy was now ready for him. I actually was concerned as he had his cock pretty far into her mouth but she barely gagged and seemed to be enjoying it! It's been a long time since I'd seen her pussy looking so ready too - I realized it's been quite a few weeks since I saw her in this raw state and as I stood there silently I have to say that while it surely made me horny to see her like that - it also made me incredibly excited knowing what I was about to see.

I wasn't disappointed. She pulled Paul's cock out of her mouth and I have to say that it looked obscenely big - the head of it seemed huge and was visibly wet from her mouth. She giggled and laughed and eagerly moved to let him between her legs and then she squealed as she felt him rub it up and down against her swollen pussy. And I will tell you that I moved closer to them for when he began to start to push into her. I've seen it many times before but this time I was more aware of the sounds she would make as he would push more and more at her - finally just as the head of his cock popped into her she let out a loud "ooooh god" and then just moaned "ohhhhh" for a few seconds as I saw him barely pushing in and out of her with the head of his cock now inside her. I could almost see it as he pulled back and opened her up a bit. They looked just so almost angelic together. The bareness of her pussy just looked beautiful wrapped around his cock. And I'll say it - at that moment - there's no one else I'd rather have fucking her - including myself. At that moment - honestly - him in her is simply perfect.

Should I share how incredible it was to see them change positions? To see his huge (it looked huge) pull out of her leaving her gaping open and raw was just awesome - again - maybe because it's been a while or what was in my head - but it looked so intense as she would move herself up on top of him and lower herself down onto his cock with a loud squishing sound. Even more was how she simply just dropped herself down onto him which made them both groan out loud. Again, I don't know if it'd been because it'd been so long - but it felt like I couldn't get enough and nor could she. To see her frantically rubbing her clit and squeezing her breasts as she rode his cock to an intense body-shaking orgasm was just amazing.

When we'd talked she told me that Paul was a lot more at ease with me jerking off while I was watching them. She even said to me that she loved seeing me - again knowing it was because I was so horny about watching them. So when she did finally roll over onto her back and lay there inviting him to retake her - she smiled when she saw that I'd already slid off my pants and underwear and that I was stroking my cock. She smiled as she looked at me and then both of our gazes moved to between her legs as Paul's cock truly appeared as if it simply needed a place to be - it was hard and looked ominous with the huge head of it now dark red. Where it was hard for him to push into her when they'd started - her pussy easily accepted him back inside and her legs wrapped around his back as she began to kiss him passionately and they began to get into a rhythm together.

I watched for just a few minutes as I realized that they were much closer to their Big-O than I'd thought. But I guess between her horniness and the lead time they'd had downstairs, that this was going to be happen much sooner than I'd thought. Needless to say, my cock kept right up. Seeing her wetness seeping out of her with each stroke he took was really beautiful - hearing her softly moan as he'd push deep into her and stay there only to hear it get louder as he'd pull back. When he started to thrust deeper and faster into her I knew he was finally reaching his point. My own balls were aching by then too as I could just feel their excitement. Finally - in a thrusting motion I know all too well I knew he was on the verge. I moved up to be a little closer to them and as I did so he took his final few motions before I watched him push all the way into her and began to grunt. His butt cheeks tightened with each grunt and below him I could see her thrashing her head back and forth as she built up to and then exploded in her own intense orgasm that left even me speechless. He stayed deep in her as her body wracked about until she began to catch her breath and then as he kissed her he took a last few strokes in her before he pulled out of her leaving her lying there looking totally obscene. By the time I looked down I'd left my load of cum all over the side of the bed and some on the floor.

With one last kiss on her cheek he turned to me and smiled and said "she is amazing...." and as he lifted himself away from her limp body he said quietly to me "thanks man, she is the best.....". He looked down and saw I'd cum a lot and he smiled and said "glad you enjoyed it too" as if it were nothing and then he simply walked past me naked with his cock now dangling there also limp and wet. My eyes followed him to the bathroom and when I looked back at my wife she was lying there with her eyes open and smiling broadly. "See what I mean....." she said softly "it's so incredible...." and then as if she suddenly realized it was me she turned to me and said "oh honey, are you okay... I"m sorry.... I really needed that though.....". I nodded and said I was okay and I told her honestly and again without even really thinking about it I said "you're beautiful honey.... I loved being here....". She smiled at me and shifted herself up against the headboard a bit and up onto her elbows. She lay there with her legs spread and she just looked at me and said "do you... you know... want it?". I giggled and smiled and nodded yes and I moved to take Paul's place - or at least his place on the bed. As I leaned down she said "just a little baby... you know.....". I had to hold myself back but feeling her tender lips on my tongue and beneath my fingertips as I gently spread her apart was amazing - her vagina was soooo hot! Even my tongue must have felt cool to her as her pussy felt like it was on fire to me. I licked and at first there was very little - just the sweet taste of Sue's juices but as she moaned softly I could feel her body tensing and then releasing and I realized she was squeezing out his load for me. Sure enough, a few moments later I could feel the semen I've come to know the taste of very well now.

 

[Wannabe93066]

That was fucking hot! Did you get to watch round 2?

 

[SquirmingSub]

Steve - What a great weekend for all three of you. It would seem that all is falling into place and Sue is able to be her truest self now with Paul and with you. You are seeing and experiencing the comfort level of what is like to have another person as part of the overall extended relationship. Enjoy your journey and that path in which you and Sue are traveling together.

 

[ShadowCuck]

Anything exciting happen for Wednesday night?

 

[SoonToBe]

It has been an exceedingly busy week, capped off by my telling her to go see Paul after work today so I could unwind alone for a while.
With the forecast for the weekend, he has again prioritized golf over Sue. I jokingly told her she shouldn't let him off so easily with her seeing him tonight and she gave me an odd reply that he would "owe her".

Last weekend, no, I did not stay for their time together. I know in the past I'd felt a little self-conscious if he came out of the bathroom while I was still licking her but this last time, it didn't feel that way. I know I looked at him and he smiled and he sat on the other side of the bed as I finished. Sue giggled after a bit and said "that's enough baby" and pushed my head back a bit. I thought about kissing her but it just didn't feel right. I got up and i forget what I used to clean up my cum from the edge of the bed but by the time I looked back, she'd rolled towards him and they were kissing already. I watched for a bit until I saw her reach towards his cock and start to stroke it and I figured they wanted to be alone.

I heard them during the night, or rather I heard her during the night. Not hearing him all I could think about was him either fucking her till she orgasmed or fingering her - but that he didn't. So in the morning, knowing he was going off to play golf on top of it all, I knew he was going to have one last time with her. I was surprised that I'd heard them in the bathroom and other commotion as much as I did before I heard her soft moans and his grunting.

I left them alone and was down in the kitchen when I heard the door open upstairs and then heard footsteps. I knew it was Paul and he came in and simply said "you okay there Steve?" I turned to him and said "yeah, fine" and I said it sincerely, as it was okay, and I told him that I hoped he had a good round on the links. He said thanks and I said the same to him before he left.

I knew that she was still upstairs but I gave her a few more minutes alone. Maybe I shouldn't have because by the time I got up there she was already out of bed in the bathroom. A second later she came out wearing panties and just looked at me. By the end of the day on Sunday she was prancing around naked so I thought it was good that I didn't say anything to her about them earlier.

 

[SoonToBe]

So - we had a fun weekend together here. It was nice that she went and saw Paul on Friday night as we had our Saturday free.
She kept her panties on from when she got home late Friday until just after lunch on Saturday - at which point she said she felt better and let me watch as she got changed. She giggled and showed me the wet spot in them. It was a bit of an impromptu decision but we decided to take a trip down to the nude beach on Saturday afternoon and get there after the morning crowd had begun to head home so we arrived just about 3pm. We trekked out with our cooler and umbrella and some music and pitched ourselves for the afternoon. She surely had my eyes as she stood and undressed in front of the world. Something still so arousing seeing her stand there and take her beach shirt off leaving her in her 2-piece and then to see her just unclip the top followed by her pushing down and stepping out of the bottoms!

We sat back from the crowds a bit but a good number of guy still walked by. We drank a bit and after a while, she started to share some of her more girlfriend-ish thoughts at times with me. She began to talk about sex-related stuff and after a few moments she realized it was me and not a girlfriend and she apologized if she'd made me feel uncomfortable. She'd told me how erotic it was to her to really be able to enjoy sex with a lover as she is and how she was enjoying how it had changed how she felt about sex and how she didn't want it to be something 'ordinary' right now. I told her I understood and that I did want her to feel she could tell me stuff like that. I told her that knowing it's something she feels strongly about and wants to enjoy was arousing to me and that I wanted this time to be what she needed. She giggled and said that she 'really' enjoys the physical aspect of letting herself go with Paul and how having to not be with him at times is good for her in that it makes her hornier. She looked at me and I told her it was okay and in my buzzed state I joked that "you're probably still leaking his cum right now and you have to ask me if it turns me on" She giggled and as I said, we were a bit buzzed and she joked "let me check". She scanned the beach quickly and then pulled her knees back and slid a finger into her pussy and then licked it off and just said "yes" and she started to laugh out loud now causing others to look over. It was just a fun moment between us and I laughed right along with her. We kissed as we both calmed down and the fun moment turned into a romantic one for both of us. I pulled my towel over me a bit to hide my hardon.

We swam for a bit but the water was a bit rough and instead we walked for a bit down and then back up the beach. She liked to walk in the water's edge and would bend over for shells or whatever - and I'm sure to flash me whenever she could too as she was all giggles the whole way. The rest of the day was filled with relaxing and the occasional continued sharing of her thoughts and feelings. She kept asking me if I really wanted to hear all this - as if I'd mind..... lol.

It was fairly revealing to hear her tell more of her side of how she feels. She shared that she had understood how I felt when I came to her and said that I was beta or wanted to explore being (more) beta. She said that she knew it was hard for me to tell her that but that I had done it she also knew meant something significant to me. But she also told me how it had taken her a while to feel okay about it too, that it wasn't something I wanted to take away from her, but that it was something I wanted to give her to enjoy. I told her she was right and that she should enjoy it. She giggled and said "that's what a girlfriend would say". So I continued. It felt kind of different but instead of being a girlfriend, I went the beta route. I told her I wanted her to enjoy this now because she can and that for whatever reason things have worked out - it's what she should do.

When it rained yesterday morning - we both laughed when I told her "see what he gave up" inferring Paul's choice of golf vs Sue for Sunday morning.

 

[peakmb]

“It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent that survives. It is the one that is most adaptable to change.” Contrary to what many believe, Charles Darwin did not actually write these words but they were coined later to paraphrase what he was trying to say in ‘Origin of the Species’. That book was published in late 1859, a little more than a year before the US Civil War. Much has been written about both events and the thinking behind them since.

This may seem a strange way to begin a new contribution to this thread but I find myself trying to process the end game to Steve’s happy position and Sue’s grasp of her new sex life. I think my key thought is that the current position cannot last or be sustained. The fact is that change is inevitable, cannot be resisted to any sustainable degree and the critical issue going forward will be Steve’s desire for Sue, and Sue’s desire for Steve. Change will slowly force the current balance to shift. It may be that Steve’s wants and needs in this continue to erode and he becomes happier in his increasingly celibate state, it may be that they reverse slowly and his desire starts to become frustration. It may equally be that Sue’s sexual desire for Steve continues to erode and she sees him more and more as a confidante and best friend than a lover, and that this becomes something she cannot reverse mentally. I suspect this direction more than a reversal which swells her sexual need for Steve again, but this equally could happen.

The key takeaway is that change will happen, there is little to ensure that both of them change at the same pace and in the same direction, so at some point a greater conflict will occur. Not now, maybe not for a year or more, but it will. Will they cope? Well, Steve’s capacity for compromise and Sue’s rapid reaction to threats will work for a while but in reality will only slowly build resentment and frustration in them both.

Sexual intimacy creates a bond, a glue that binds people together in spite of conflict. It is different and more powerful than shared interests and economic or social ties. It is becoming more and more absent here. There are tougher times ahead.

 

[ShadowCuck]

Peak - I can’t say you are wrong about what will eventuslly happen, but I don’t think you are correct about the lack of sexual intimacy. It is possible that Sue and Steve continue to enjoy a high degree of sexual intimacy, despite the lack of vaginal sex. Much of this dynamic they share is highly sexually focused. In some ways, it appears that Paul functions, in the marriage, as a physical and emotional “fucktoy” for thr triangle. This is not to deny the reality of sexual and emotional intimacy between Paul and Sue, but those things, far from detracting from the intimacy between Sue and Steve, could be functioning as an enhancement to their own intimacy.

The denial of sexual contact is itself a sexual arousal stimulus for both Steve and Sue at this point. The teasing is functioning the same way. While they mostly don’t have sex with each other, and Sue’s primary sexual contact is with Paul, the sexual relationship between Steve and Sue is an integral feature of all of Sue’s sex with Paul. Then there are the various instances of outercourse between Steve and Sue, with her supervising and assisting Steve’s masturbation with regularity, sometimes even masturbating along with Steve. The sexual activity is redefined away from genital contact, but their brains are all about each other quite frequently. I wonder whether Sue thinks about Steve while she’s having sex with Paul, even to delight in the naughty notion that she is giving Paul something she is denying Steve, and whether this increaees her arousal and pleasure in having sex with Paul, in the same way that Steve is aroused to a hair trigger by how Sue is denying him while lavishing her sex on Paul. Since this is by consent, and both seem to be getting off on it, it may not be a threat at all to intimacy.

Now, Steve says that he’s great with things as they are, with the mixture of pain and desire that form the arousing emotional cocktail for him, but that he’ll also be okay with giving Sue more sexual contact, should she decide that’s what she wants. Right now, Sue is riding the cuckoldress high, enjoying all aspects of ger situation, including the acts of teasing and denying Steve, not just for their effect of Steve, but for her own arousal. What will be the test is to see what happens if Steve starts to want more sex, and Sue does not want more sex with Steve, but would prefer to deny him in his more intense yearning. Will that happen? Will Steve resent the denial at that point, or will he become even more aroused by it? Would Sue cave in and have “obligation sex” with Steve in such a scenario, and what impact would that have on them?

It’s a very complicated sexual cocktail, and ultimately, as long as Steve and Sue keep their marital relationship as the top priority, I think they can negotiate whatever comes along to deepen their connection.

 

[SoonToBe]

Another hellish day at work today or I'd have replied or posted sooner.
Paul is coming tonight rather than tomorrow - and will stay overnight and then leave for his golf-game tomorrow. Apparently he's staying overnight Sat-Sun wherever he is going. I was happy that Sue chose tonight over going away with him (if she could have).
Hopefully more later tonight - but likely I'll be tied to the phone as we have again things going on with folks overseas.
Thanks Shadow - appreciate your point of view and support. I can say that given what's going on with work, I'm actually happy to have Paul fucking her tonight.

 

[peakmb]

Shadow,
I think your thoughtful piece deserves an equally thoughtful response. Steve seems too busy at the moment to really think what is going on. Perhaps that’s a good thing overall, the break from being that close to it might help his perspective. Certainly his own sex life, supervised or not, has hardly rated a mention recently and not all for the past two weeks. It’s another sign of how deep into sub space Steve can get at times, (or maybe just how busy he is) in that his priority is telling us about Sue.

I think the first thing to say is again how little the English language helps is really discussing the issues here. Given that as the dominant world language, and one that has blatantly stolen words from virtually all the other major languages, it still has so little nuance in the area of sexual intimacy and love. So, are Steve and Sue intimate? Of course they are, but the ‘intimacy glue’ I was talking about comes from getting hot, wet and messy with each other, sharing bodily fluids and sleeping on the wet spot or on top of each other to avoid it. These are things that Sue loves to do, but not with Steve. I can’t even remember the last time she actually swallowed his come, certainly without at least sharing it or feeding it all to Steve. That level of intimacy is missing. Do they still hold hands, talk about stuff in their lives (including sex), kiss before leaving for work? Of course they do. This is the intimacy that may even have grown as a result of their current lifestyle, but it is only a little more evolved than that between best friends or brother and sister at times.

It suits an argument for the ‘evolved triangle’ to think of Sue thinking of Steve when she is having sex with Paul. Unfortunately Steve has reported several times that Sue does not do this, indeed she completely switches off any thought of him when with another man, and has taken some time to get to her current state in trying to not think of him at all in a sexual sense, even when she is not actually with Paul. Read carefully what Steve has reported here. Sue is getting excited by denying Steve, by watching him masturbate knowing he is denied her body. That is not the same as being sexually excited by him, far from it. That Steve is currently excited by her denial is the current balance to this, and no doubt vastly enjoyable to them both, but neither are being directly sexually excited by the other and the longer this goes on, the greater the danger that one or the other will find difficulty in the future in doing so. Steve in many ways displays the characteristics of an addict in this area, always searching for a higher fix, believing he can drop it any time he wants, but being fed in his addiction by his wife, who has her own reasons for continuing with it. I don’t and wouldn’t deny that it works for them at the moment. I just don’t believe it can last or end without pain.

 

[ShadowCuck]

See, Peak, you say it yourself, though: Sue is getting excited by denying Steve. Do you think that’s not sexual excitement, or that it is not thinking about Steve sexually? I think that it is impossible for Sue to be having sex with Paul without the thought of denying Steve that pleasure, and giving him the erotic gift of that denial being an integral aspect of her implicit sexual thinkng. I think that “taking from Steve and giving to Paul” is part of her sexual arousal mechanism. Even lying around naked with Paul is happening in the context of mostly wearing panties around Steve. It is inescapable.

I’m probably never going to get to experience this dynamic, but I also think I understand what this is like. I would love to have a conversation with Sue, to understand the mental aspects of this for her, partly because I love learning, and am fascinated with all nonviolent aspects of human behavior, partly because I would love to have Sue, or someone like her explain to my conservative wife how this could be okay, and a path to deepening intimacy. That aside, I think that sexual intimacy is in the brain, and that fluid sharing is just one of the possible paths. Whatever words are being used, Sue still thinks of Steve as a sexual partner, whose primary mode of sexual communion doesn’t involve him getting to pleasure her physically at this point. She gets off on him desiring her but not having her, she denies him the active role in sexual contact, and limits her sexual contact with him, but they freely fuck each others minds quite frequently. They are intensely sexually involved with each other, even when she is allegedly “not thinkinh about Steve at all.” Being married to Steve, and having that primary sexual relationship redefined for the moment is an essential aspect of her sex with Paul.

 

[SquirmingSub]

I have to say up front that this exchange between ShadowCuck and PeakMB is a positively creative exchange.

Peak - you and I have multiple exchanges through the years on the threads about the ever evolving dynamic between Steve, Sue, and Paul. We have had areas were we have agreed and areas were we have strongly disagreed with each other. We have been following Steve's adventures on multiple forums through the years. Steve himself has evolved during the last few years that Sue has been seeing Paul and Steve and Sue have learned a considerable amount about themselves along with how each of them had viewed there sexual relationship in the past. They are now in truly uncharted territory for them as a couple and how the relationship with Paul truly differs from how they involved other men in their marriage through the years. We all should provide some level of acceptance to what Steve is experiencing and remember what works for one couple is not what always works for other couples as we are all very different even when we share similar lifestyle interest.

ShadowCuck - I have found reading your recent post very on point with my view point of were I think Steve and Sue are currently at with their respective relationship intimacy. As I have shared with the group in the past, I have my own personally experiences in this area of the lifestyle that Steve is currently experiencing with Sue & Paul. Those feelings (physical, psychological, emotional, etc) is something that most people never truly understand until they have had first hand experiences with. For someone that claims to have not had first hand experience in that area, I believe that you have expressed a considerably good understanding of were I believe Steve and Sue currently are positioned relationship wise. Steve did ask Sue some time back to find her sexual pleasures with Paul. Steve put Sue on a path that allowed Sue to eventually give herself to Paul guilt-free. Everyone continues to speak of this has denial when in reality, what was once denial is truly now the norm. Steve is truly not be denied, he essential provide Sue with that in which she needed to transition to Paul in a variety of ways. In many ways, Steve is getting everything he desires in the way that he desires it. His marriage with seems to be in a great place considering that they are empty nesters and both enjoying life as it is for them.

With all that said, you both make some very good points and do support your own views with seemingly reasonable expressions.