She Is His

[peakmb]

Steve,
Thank you for your honest response. It was already clear that you are happy with how things are at the moment and that you find the thought of exploring pussy denial exciting as an exercise. I have already expressed by doubts as to how long you may want to sustain this but that is not relevant at the moment.

What I do think you should try to find the answer to is Sue's motivation in wanting to chip away at her sexual bonding to yourself. For several years she has already enjoyed free access to a succession of lovers, all with either active encouragement or at worse little interference from yourself. Why then, does she feel the need to break down such an important bond? She can still have her lovers and leave it in place after all. Don't let her answer in terms of what you want either. It's what Sue wants in this area that you need to understand.

This bond is what brought you together in the first place and for most of the last 30 years it has been an important part of the glue that has held you together. I simply do not see the over riding need to reduce it so much when it could instead simply be put on ice.

Why don't you try turning the tables for once and ask her tonight while she is horny and before she has any release!

 

[Enigma632]

Steve,

Perhaps you should use the hall pass that Sue offered you last December of sex with another woman, for two reasons:

1 It might help you to focus your understanding of you "not missing out on intercourse (with Sue)", i.e. are you missing it but the satisfaction of giving Sue what she wants is over-riding it, or is your libido actually dropping?

2 Also give you an idea of how long you really can / do want to go without PIV sex, rather than being lead by Sues open-ended timescale

 

[digger7275]

Steve,

I agree with Peak and Enigma.

And with the weather being what it is. Today and tonight would be a good time to reflect and discuss with Sue.

 

[SoonToBe]

Peak - I sort of see what you're saying but I also believe I understand her side of it.
I actually see 2 things that are going on. Its a little scary but I don't believe it is as you've portrayed it.

One thing I see is that her actions are akin to my beta desires - that she wants to further my experience with this. I see this through how she asks about whether this will be a permanent/long-term situation. My thinking is that she wants to have her sexual pleasure with or without me and if I truly want to reduce or even eliminate it between us, that she wants to fulfill herself with him. I'm actually still learning and experiencing how I feel being beta and knowing what it means, for us. It isn't as scary as I'd thought it would be. Contemplating no longer being sexual with her is strangely arousing to me and she knows and understands it. I don't think this is as arousing to her - but she surely feels arousal at the enjoyment she has with him.

But the other is what she's said early on, that she'd like to reset things between us. At other times she's said she'd like to 'forget' how sex was between us and then have us reconnect together and restart when she's done with Paul. I know that seems vague and also hurtful but it's not - in some ways I even like the idea. Even now, I have to say that the memories of the feelings of being inside her have faded. Sure I can remember the feeling of her pussy milking my cock and the intense feeling of releasing and cumming while deep in her. But the thought of truly feeling like we are starting anew is really exciting to me too.

I think we both know this may not be where we end though. Neither of us truly knows how we're going to feel about this as time goes by. It's exciting for her now, but will that fade as our new norm becomes just that?

Will I continue to be beta, will I want more? I don't know. Right now, I can honestly say that I do not want to have sex with her. As strange as that sounds.

Enigma - I'm not sure I need to take her up on that offer right now. I honestly don't have the mental need for intercourse even if I might enjoy it physically. I actually want to see how this goes for us and how it makes me feel. So far, as I've said, it feels strangely arousing!

 

[SoonToBe]

Digger - just saw your last update (before I posted mine). Yes, tonight may be a good night to discuss things.

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
You have mentally created a link between how you believe Sue feels about being a Dom and how you think you currently feel about being beta. Your mutual positions are currently only a matter of luck and timing. Witness what happened last year and the year before for how this 'mutual' feeling can collapse so quickly. You relying on the support of a connection here that is only in your head.

You cannot answer a question about how Sue feels by referencing your own feelings on the issue. Sue doesn't need you not to desire her (or otherwise) in order to desire and enjoy Paul. You have witnessed how much she enjoys him (and clearly doesn't think about you) even when you are even in the room with him. How much do you really believe she thinks about you when the door is closed or she is in his house. Quite. If you enjoy the denial, it can only help her to think that her satisfied position can go on for longer, but in the heat of the moment I doubt whether even this crosses her mind. Sue has a few weapons up her sleeve this time if she detects your interest in denial is flagging. She has shown already she is prepared to deploy them, but not waste them.

As to the issue of reset. We are not machines, but mere bags of chemicals. We can recover from instantaneous stops like drowning or heart attacks with resets, but any extended stoppage of blood leads to atrophy and death of the region. I merely think you need to know whether Sue believes she is risking what she might be, whether that is in fact her long term intention, and if not what her long term intention is, because at this time it isn't clear, but the risks are, no matter how much you try to cover them up by saying you are happy with how things are right now.

I know your views on chastity training, but one thing it has going for it is that it focuses your sexual release on your wife. No sexual release without her being the direct focus, even if that is only masturbation. Over the last five years I would bet your orgasms from masturbation have outweighed PIV by maybe 4 : 1, maybe more and clearly more this year. You are not experiencing a lack of desire, or even sexual output, you have merely switched further into the jerk off zone. One which itself is addictive and difficult to break out of, especially in penis sensitivity / erection hardness terms. But this last bit is your problem, not Sue's to deal with.

Anyway, all food for thought I suppose. Enjoy your talk tonight. It might just be more important than the release.

 

[SoonToBe]

Peak - I see your point and I hope to ask her tonight about her longer-term intentions. I agree that it's a good time to ask her about them and I can use my current contentment as the springboard for that. Given my current state, I can share my receptiveness to whatever her thoughts are and then go from there. Depending on her reply, that will govern whether there's a need for further questions I guess.

I do also well know your comments about masturbation vs PIV sex. Indeed, a lot of masturbation does make it hard to return to PIV as the sensations and level of control change - it's why I would refrain from doing it to excess in the past when I knew she and I would be intimate together, even with the condoms, there was still a marked difference. She is well aware of the physical difference in orgasm for me - that manual stimulation is nowhere near as physically fulfilling as intercourse or oral-sex as both of those are more hands-off if you will and lead to, for me at least, much more intense orgasms. I'm sure that's another reason I am always feeling horny, that masturbation never totally relieves the feelings of desire - which of course, for me, makes me smile because that is part of the root of my beta feelings.

 

[peakmb]

Bon chance Steve. Stick to your guns and get Sue's answers before she turns it back on you! We all know where that ends up.

'Yes of course dear, I'm perfectly happy with your plans!'

 

[digger7275]

Steve,
I hope you had the discussion with Sue. And could share with us Sue's desires. .What she wants going forward.
Her view on You and Paul for the future. And, as Peak has said, not her doing this for you.

 

[SoonToBe]

Well, I'll share the sex part of last night first as it has been a long time since I masturbated while watching her playing with herself with 'Jim' her favorite vibrator/dildo. She let me know before we even got started that I was going to have a real treat and she even said that she wanted to 'put on a show' for me. i knew she was quite horny so I wasn't surprised when she used plenty of lube and honestly - her pussy looked absolutely incredible the more she worked it. So awesome to see her literally fucking herself - including her intentionally pulling it out and letting me see her gaping open when she'd pull it out! Needless to say I enthusiastically joined her. I eagerly watched as she brought herself to multiple orgasms including a pretty huge one when she heard me start to cum and watched as I let go all over her leg and our bed. You all know the rest - but I can say that I did lean over and lick her thigh clean If someone wants more details, I'm happy to provide.

What I believe most here want to hear or know about is what we talked about.

The big one - why cut me off - and the simple answer she gave me was two fold. One, of course, was that it's what I want and that she is doing it because it turns me on. I told her that I know and am relieved that this is a key underlying part of all of this, that somehow under it all, she is doing this for me. But when I pushed her she gave another simple answer - actually 2 of them. One is that she wants to - and she admitted that she likes denying me and likes the effect on our relationship where she even said that I sort of worship her, or more aptly, that I worship her pussy - more of how intoxicated I am and how it makes her feel. The second part was more of what I had thought, she looked at me and said that she can't do/experience all she wants with Paul and to then still be sexual with me. She shared a lot of her thoughts - some of it was how and what she wants to feel about Paul and how she wants to have things happen. I pushed her and one thing she pointed out is that he and I have totally different styles in bed and she laughed - how differently shaped we are too! It made me laugh but she told me that going back and forth between me and him - she said made sex worse (less good?) for her with both of us - and how when she's just with Paul (or me) how the sex seems to become more complete and fulfilling for her. I told her "well I'm glad it's just sex" and she laughed and said that's what it has always been and she said "I'm not looking for anything more baby.... just something different.... for me..... and for us....".

I did ask where she thinks all of this is going and I told her that I was concerned that some things that were happening may not be so easy to back out of. Fortunately this was before we were in bed because I told her about my concerns regarding her seeing me differently now and maybe not wanting me later on if/when we are ready for that. She looked at me and asked me what I meant. So I went for broke. I told her that I know she sees me as more beta or "less masculine" and I told her she's said that to me so I asked her how she thought that would work as she associated me less and less with her sexuality. At first she said that it's not something that concerns her but she then clarified it by telling me how she has associated me with Paul, sort of the yin-yang kind of thing. In her mind, her desire with Paul is pushing me out, but if/when that declines, then it will revert back. I asked her how she can be so sure and she giggled and said "I do still love you and I do still love your big cock baby!" I mentioned about all of the other stuff and she giggled and said "baby, all of that still needs me to want it" and I understood her to mean that her denying me and all of that is where she needs to want to do that to (for) me - and that from what I understood from her, she feels as her desires for Paul run their course, that her desires for me will resume. She laughed and said that all of the other stuff "seeing you" and that stuff all makes it easier for her to do stuff with Paul but she said it's not changing how she feels about me.

It naturally led to me asking.... "So, what do you think IS going to happen with you and Paul". She laughed and the first thing she said "well, I think he'd fuck me forever if he could" which made me laugh out loud. But she then said that she knows that this isn't forever with him. She giggled and then looked at me and said "that doesn't mean everything goes back though" and when I asked her what she meant she looked at me and said "we talked about this baby....." and after a pause she said "we'll have sex again baby.... I know that....." and then she added "but we talked and right now, to be really honest.... well, I'm not sure when you'll get to cum in me again....". I just looked at her and couldn't think of what to say other than "huh?" and she looked at me and said "that's going to be the last part to come back baby" and she said reminded me that we had talked about this and that I said I might be able to live with that and she smiled and said "I do like denying you baby, that I won't lie about" and she teased me that we'll go back to how it was ".... you know, you'll use condoms still but... you know.... you'll still get to go without sometimes....".

I looked at her and I told her I wasn't sure that was okay and she said "it's not that you're never going to get to do that again baby" and she kissed me and said "it's just that I think I'm going to want that to be special for us when it happens again baby....". She came up closer to me and told me "wouldn't it be really exciting to you know, be out with me on a romantic evening and when we get home, you know, I surprise you.... think about how exciting it's going to be when that time comes" and she then added that she didn't want me to think it was just going to be an automatic thing, that after she was over Paul, that I would simply take his place. i know a lot of people are going to poke holes in all of this, that maybe it's some new rouse from her or a new twisting of the rules or whatever - but I have to tell you - the honesty I felt from her and the complete openness about how she said it really did make me feel comfortable that she's being honest - and I told her so. I looked at her and I told her I loved her and that I trusted her "with our future" and she kissed me incredibly passionately and said "baby, we've gone this far and I really think it's going to be okay.... I wouldn't want this if I wasn't sure.... I love you....".

Again, I know she or I will get flamed for how this went down but it did leave me feeling comfortable. I mean it's not that I'm against her doing this, I just wanted to feel a bit more reassured which she was successful at.

I did ask her when she thought this thing with Paul would run it's course. She looked at me and held my hands and told me she wasn't completely sure. She said she'd be honest with me and said that a part of her sees it possibly declining later on this year "sometime after summer...." but she also looked at me and said that she wanted to feel a certain way "like I'm his" before she can see that happening and she said that it's possible it might not be until we're into next year "but nothing beyond next summer baby... I think by then no matter what I'll be tired of him....". I didn't say much but after a moment I did smile and when she asked I simply said "so he'll maybe be around till next summer" and she smiled and said yes, that she can't see it going beyond that.

She teased me after that telling me that I get to enjoy "watching him fuck me for another year..."......

 

[Enigma632]

It's clear that Sue knows what she wants to achieve with Paul, but, since for her there's a large emotional part (a need for a "feeling") she probably doesn't have much more idea than the rest of us when she'll achieve it, whether it's later in 2018 or after summer 2019.

If I were Steve though I think I would be annoyed (not sure that that's the right word) that what was first going to be a couple of months into the New year became "till sometime in the summer" and now maybe "not beyond next summer" BUT I'm not Steve who clearly is exploring a very different set of values to mine.

I think that I would also be concerned that Steve's sex life isn't going to go back to what it was before - "that after she was over Paul, that I would simply take his place", but again I'm not Steve and maybe he will need / enjoy / desire the sort of teasing (condoms etc.) that Sue talked about.

However what I would say to Steve is keep on having these talks with Sue and keep on bringing up your concerns so that Sue remains aware of them.
You are giving Sue an amazing gift and while some would say that when you freely give such a gift you do so without expecting anything in return I think that you really do / will deserve something very special from Sue when she is "tired of him".

 

[peakmb]

Well Steve, think about all the times Sue has told you that Paul is about to expire from her life. I could go back and detail them all, but there's no need. You wrote them, you must remember them all. I'm amazed that overall you feel re-assured by all this.

It's clear of course that Paul would go for many years to come. He shows no inclination whatever to try to form any romantic relationship with anyone, and if he did I'm pretty certain he would try it with Sue first. He just doesn't trust enough, or invest enough time, or open up enough to get anywhere. He is not going to do a Robert and end it. He needs to be simply told nicely and he'll walk away.

Sue meantime, still seems to have a way to go to dissociate from you in order to feel all she wants with Paul. She may get there after this summer. Or not. This place, which she has been refining in her own mind for maybe three years or more, this utopia of sexual connection, she then feels happy to collapse and retreat from after getting there. Paul can go then. But the rider. This blissful place can never be shared with you. Perhaps Sue felt she got close in her earlier years with you, but you, like Moses, will never see the promised land.

Steve, maybe this conversation is the true version of the monthly 'time out' conversations Sue has agreed to before Christmas. It should be crashingly obvious that you need to revisit her real plans regularly. I suspect if you do that the Paul exit point will move forward each month. By about a month.

Now maybe that is ok in your mind, and if it is none of us have right to argue. We may think your crazy or enlightened but it truly is your call. On the other hand, if it's not ok as an end point, then you need to come up with an alternative. You have the luxury of some time. You're happy at the moment and seem to have no clue of an exit strategy of your own (baring throwing the stick in the wheel like last time). This time you may need something a little more elegant.

 

[digger7275]

Steve,
Sounds like everything is going great.
You got confirmation from Sue that it's just sexual. Doesn't appear anything is changing except you are going more beta. And all 3 seem to enjoy it.
I agree with others here that it's most important for you to have the "time out talk" frequently. And get Sue's thoughts other than" I'm doing it for you".
Plans this weekend?

 

[SoonToBe]

I'll share this morning that last night in bed we talked a bit more. She told me that "if this isn't good for you or you don't think it's good for us then just say so" and as she talked she continued to really push that if I didn't want this, that she wouldn't ask for as much. She did say that she would be disappointed as she is truly starting to feel what she's wanted to and she even said that she hadn't quite realized how she felt but now that she is living out her desire - that it is truly giving her what she is looking for. When I asked her that she simply answered that she wants to feel like a teenager again - when I pushed more she said that she wants to feel the sexual arousal with Paul and admitted that denying me is definitely part of her arousal. But again she looked at me and said "if you aren't enjoying it though, then it's not good for us" so again, unless she's lying or whatever - this was a non-sexual and non-intoxicated a moment as ever - and I honestly believe her. She knows that despite my slight aura of concern/complaint/wishfulness - that she knows this is as intense for me as it is for her. I do honestly believe that if I suddenly were to voice my displeasure or true complaints, that I think the Sue-and-Paul train would derail. In a way, it seems when I can get her to truly express herself as I think she did - that it ultimately seems that my continued pleasure in all of this is driving her.

So please, all here - understand while this does sting and leave me forlorn, lonely and sometimes quite down - at other times it is the most intoxicating and energizing thing I've ever felt. It honestly didn't scare me the other day when she told me that I may still be waiting even longer when she is ready for sex with me to allow me to cum in her again - if we get there. Actually to be honest, I was kind of turned on by that in a crazy way - that I know for her to think or ask about that, that it has an arousal factor for her too - and it doesn't bother me to want her to be aroused like that.

I know - those who don't understand simply will not. Sorry. But I can't apologize for what feels right to me even if it doesn't for you.

There's just 2 other pieces to share right now. One is that, after missing Wednesday, she has assured me that she wants Paul to come over again tomorrow. But the second is that we are going to watch the forecast for next week and if conditions remain good - we are talking about possibly a last ski-weekend on 3/17 to 3/18, yes with Paul.

Gotta run for now.

 

[digger7275]

Steve,

I believe you and I believe Sue. I'm sure the "time out and review" talks were very emotional for both. Now you three can move on.

Hope you learned more of what Sue wants. And you seem to be agreeable, if not enthusiastic, to let Sue guide you both into the future. Sue has guided and taught you and Paul. And has done an excellent job, in my opinion.

Can't say that I can imagine the range of your feelings. Wish I have had your experiances. But never apologize for them.

Again, all 3 of you are in a good zone. What does the future hold? Who the hell knows!

 

[peakmb]

Excellent update Steve. That's great news really. It means you can go as long as YOU want to. If that means till next summer, then so be it. Not sure whether your equipment will still work. Maybe you should arrange for a testing every six months! I think you trust Sue in what she said though. It's still probably worth revisiting this from time to time, but I say you can relax now for some time. Just by itself that will probably mean you enjoy it more too. Well done.

 

[Enigma632]

Steve,

You must be one of the most devoted and giving husbands that I know in that you are willing to give Sue so much (mostly) without any regard to the cost to you and for that I salute you.

I think that in most (maybe not all) of my comments that while I have thought that some of Sue's actions were not good for you I didn't really think that they were ever done out of any malice, more because she was focused on what she wants / wanted. However....
by saying that she would be disappointed if you called time does seem to be (ab-)using your devotion and giving-ness as well as playing on the fact that you are experiencing this very much in the now (where you are enjoying it) rather than addressing any concerns that you might have about the extended (extending?) time scale.

That said I suspect that if Sue were to think about the end-point and a return to normalcy with you (whatever that is) then it would diminish her pleasure of the now and her climb towards the the climax(!) that she is seeking.

Not only that but that if you were to call time now / soon then maybe there would be repercussions for the two of you, Sue might resent not getting to where she is striving and you would miss the pleasure that you get from her relationship with Paul as well as experience guilt from not letting her get to where she wants.

So, maybe, we your readers should let you enjoy the now and not worry you or ourselves with what might or might not happen in the future.

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
Talking of enjoying the now, at all times previously when you have challenged or questioned Sue's vision of the future but then gone along with her views (however outrageous), Sue has found some way to reward you for it. It will be interesting to see how the weekend pans out therefore, especially as next weekend you may be away. Any inklings?

 

[SoonToBe]

Well, this is a surprise in many ways. Paul will be coming over in just a few hours, before it's getting dark out and he's offered to help clear our yard of some of the big/huge branches that have come down in the snowstorm. Last night she told me he had offered without being prompted and she giggled that she'll be inside getting horny watching her 2 men working out in the backyard. I of course teased back that he'll be the one getting the best reward. She smiled and said that was the other thing she wanted to talk to me about. I wasn't sure what she was getting at so I kind of sat up in bed and she slid over to me and smiled and said "I want to do something for you... I guess..... A pre-reward.....". It took me a moment to realize she was pulling down my lounge pants and underwear and before I really knew what was happening she'd moved down and was really starting to get into stroking my cock and as I started to say whatever it was I was going to say was when she took the head of my cock in her mouth and I just lay back and moaned.

I'd showered earlier last night after exercising so I was clean and she knew it. She was really getting into sucking me but I could also tell she wasn't trying to get me off, not just yet. She pulled her mouth off it and teased me several times about how big my cock gets ".... these days...." and at other times how it turns her on that she gets to play with my big cock but that it also turns her on that that is all she'll be doing with it. When I started to thrust into her mouth she pulled back a bit and pulled her mouth off and just stroked me while she felt how horny I was. She told me she knew I was jerking off a lot and she knew that was good for me and then she smiled and said "but I also know what you probably really need baby....". I tipped my head up so I could look at her and as I did she reached over and opened the night-stand and took out a bottle of lubricant. It took me a minute until she said "... do you want me to do it to you?....". It wasn't until I felt her finger around my butt that I realized she wanted to do that to me. I guess I had a look of uncertainty for a moment until she said "... you liked it last time...". I nodded my head and lay back and a moment later I felt her magic start. I can't even describe how intense it felt - it seemed like it lasted forever but once I felt her fingers - I know it was only a matter of moments later. She let me thrust into her mouth as much as I wanted and needed until she knew I was about to explode and with that I guess she curled her fingertip or whatever because with a grunt I literally filled her mouth and more. I never knew I could cum so much, even after as much as I jerk off lately but she gagged at first and then, my god, I felt like a teenager!

The moment I stopped thrusting I knew what was going to happen and she didn't disappoint me. A moment later I felt her pull her mouth away and before I could even catch my breath she was on top of me. We kissed passionately and I swear it even felt like she had some kind of orgasm as we hugged each other and played with our tongues.

I slept like a baby after that and now. Geez. I'm feeling like a sponge that's been wrung out.

But I also came to a realization and it's something else that just made more sense out of what she's doing that I think I need to share.

She isn't thinking ahead at all. I started to think about her comments about when she was a teenager - and I started to think about how I was at that age. Her reminiscing about using her parents bed when she was younger made me think - I remember those years myself. I was led around my my cock most of the time with nary a thought towards the future. I'm quite sure that's what she wants - to feel that kind of freedom to enjoy the moment and desire the next one - for her - yes - to spread her legs for him one more time. Just like how it was for me when I was a teenager - I couldn't wait to find a time when I could boink my gf back then. It's weird to think back to how that kind of feeling felt - the ability and almost desire to get so turned on so quickly and to really truly want it - but not thinking about the next week or the next month - barely thinking about the next day instead.

All I can say is if she is this perceptive to give that to me last night - wow. Better than intercourse? I don't know, but my god, what i needed - for sure.

She is off getting herself prettied up - i laugh when I think about why she likes getting a manicure and pedicure and why it gets her turned on - so weird to think that I know she thinks about it as that being all she will have on later on tonight, just nail-polish. Fuck, I wish I could get hard right now and jerk off but not after last night.

More later.

 

[digger7275]

Thanks for the update. And looking forward to the whole weekend experience.

Sue does great with introducing twists and turns. Your description is great also.