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One of the "whitest" things, now becoming black

  • Thread starterBlondeGirlNextDoor
  • Start date
I can see where the fans are coming from, unfortunately. The casting choice is a little absurd to me, and frankly I don't see people being able to get into the movie at all. I'm sure the director thought he was being "progressive" or whatever by casting a black dude into the role, but really it just comes across to me as gimmicky. Not that it'll be any good regardless, most of these Marvel comic movie adaptations have been pretty crappy. The guy's defense of his role is pretty weak, too. Who really cares, though? Aside from comic nerds.
 
I think it's wrong for a black man to be playing this role, you don’t get more "white" than the norse.. Also I don’t think people complaining about this are racist.
 
There is a missunderstanding here, the movie is based on a comic, which is ofcourse originally influenced by the Norse Gods. What fans are upset about isn't that the norse god (which no one believes in anymore) is a black fella, it's rather comic fans being upset that they are completely changing the character.

It's like an orange Hulk, heck, I'd be upset if the made the Hulk orange.
 
Idris Elba's a great actor. Represented Bmore well in The Wire. Kinda dumb for him to be playin' a Norse God though! What next, a white Blade????
 
Dont tell me that Thor is being played by a black!!? Thats just stupid!
 
Thor aint gonna be black, it's one of the other Gods.
 
Elizabeth Taylor and rumored Angelina Jolie both played (will play) Cleopatra. Yeah, Cleopatra, she probably looked Midwestern *rolls eyes*, right? Also, the Samuel L. Jackson version of Nick Fury is based on the Ultimate Avengers Nick Fury, who is black.
 
maverick01 said:
Elizabeth Taylor and rumored Angelina Jolie both played (will play) Cleopatra. Yeah, Cleopatra, she probably looked Midwestern *rolls eyes*, right? Also, the Samuel L. Jackson version of Nick Fury is based on the Ultimate Avengers Nick Fury, who is black.



pssst. Cleopatra WAS white
 
“While historically there is no concrete confirmation that Cleopatra was of a darker complexion, there is more evidence than not that she was black, and not entirely of Macedonian Greek ancestry, as Shakespeare, leagues of painters, and now Hollywood would have us believe. Jolie—not so perfect.”

I'll see your white then raise you that she was born in northern Egypt, which is still in - wait for it - Africa.
 
Cleopatra was neither black nor white from what I've seen and read. Supposed to be hot as hell though :hitit:
 
to me it'd be like casting a white guy to star as martin luther king. it doesn't work and its just not right.
 
WHY QUEEN CLEOPATRA WAS DEFINITELY NOT BLACK!

Eugene Stovall


Watching a local television program recently, I heard Spike Lee express his belief that Queen Cleopatra of Egypt was black. The African-American hostess of the TV show agreed with Mr. Lee saying “Cleopatra certainly looked nothing like Elizabeth Taylor”. But the historical facts contradict Spike Lee’s belief. Queen Cleopatra VII of Egypt [for indeed that was who Spike Lee was referring to] was definitely not black. And since I have dared to follow in the footsteps of that literary genius, Frank Yerby who was known as ‘debunker of historical myth’, I realized that I had to marshal the proofs of Queen Cleopatra’s ancestry that would satisfy any reasonable person that she was a white European.

Though not proof of her ancestry, Queen Cleopatra VII’s sluttish conduct cannot be admired by anyone interested in heralding the achievements of black culture. Cleopatra behaved shamefully in the furtherance of her ambitions. Her sole interest was to control the affairs of Rome from her bedchamber. She married both her younger and elder brothers and quickly arranged for their early deaths to consolidate her hold on the throne of Alexandria. She became the mistress of Pompey, Julius Caesar as well as Mark Antony, giving birth to a number of illegitimate Roman bastards. But in the end, her faithlessness to her Roman lovers caused her own demise. Cleopatra VII died a suicide. Her only accomplishment was to secure the wealth and labor of Egypt for the Roman imperium. It took the Prophet Muhammad to free Egypt from the European slavery imposed by this Greco-Macedonian woman.

The first proof of Cleopatra’s ancestry lies in the nature of the Ptolemaic dynasty, itself. It was as impossible for a black Egyptian to be a descendant of Ptolemy and sit on his throne as it was for a Jew to head up Hitler’s Death’s Head S.S. organization. And Cleopatra was the last of the Ptolemaic dynasty to rule Egypt. This dynasty emerged and perpetrated itself by intrigue, incest, conspiracy and murder. The Ptolemies ruled from the enclave fortress of Alexandria named for Alexander the Great. No one who was not Greek, Macedonian or a slave was even given free access to the city of Alexandria, not to mention the palace. The royal family of Ptolemies was as inbred as any European royalty and the name Cleopatra was reserved for the daughters of most noble of the Greco-Macedonian families.

The first Cleopatra was the niece of Attalus, a Macedonian noble and general. Philip, Alexander’s father, had an affair with Cleopatra. When she became pregnant, Attalus ****** Philip to set aside Alexander’s mother, Olympias to marry his niece. Rather than give up the Macedonian throne to Cleopatra’s child, Olympias and Alexander hired Pausanias to assassinate Philip. Discovering how easy it was to gain the throne of Macedonia through murder, Alexander allowed his bloodlust to rage unchecked. He assaulted kingdoms in Greece and across the Aegean Sea in Persia, Armenia, Palestine, Assyria, Parthia, and finally into India. The conquered Persians were ****** to relinquish their control of Egypt to the Macedonians. Whereupon Alexander established a great port city of Alexandria at the mouth of the Nile River easily accessible to both the Mediterranean and Red seas. Alexandria faced a great harbor and was connected by earthenworks to the Island of Pharos where a gigantic lighthouse was built. The beacon of this lighthouse stretched across the Mediterranean Sea and was visible from Crete and as far away as Greece. So marvelously engineered was the lighthouse that Pharos became known as one of the seven wonders of the ancient world. Its purpose was to guide ships from Europe to Alexandria to carry away the treasures and bounty that the Macedonians had looted from temples and storehouses located all over Egypt.

In order to secure the transfer of African wealth to Europe, Alexander consulted the eunuch, Bagoas who had administered Egypt for Artaxerxes III. In orders to retain control over the Egyptian population, Bagoas recommend that Alexander declare himself a god and deny Egyptians access to Alexandria. Alexander followed the eunuch’s advice and not only did the looting of Egypt continue unhindered even in Alexander’s absence but it became a great European sanctuary affording the Europeans from Macedonia, Greece as well as all other parts of Alexander’s empire protection from and control over their Egyptian subjects. Alexandria became a European delight; every home in the city had running water, delivered by cisterns, and kept clean by slaves. There was such peace and tranquility established in Alexandria that over 500,000 precious books and scrolls from every part the Macedonian empire were delivered to a magnificent library where Greek scholars were invited to research the mysteries of man.

Alexander implemented the Greek notion of citizenship taught to him by Aristotle. No free, dark-skinned Egyptian was permitted entry into Alexandria. Only Egyptian servants and slaves were permitted. Alexander implemented the practice of castration among the slaves and servants. Castration was not new to Egyptians. Both the Egyptians and Numidians practiced castration on each other after their successive wars. In 1300 B.C. the Egyptians castrated over 13,000 Numidian prisoners of war. But now Alexander coined a new word for castrates. He called them eunouchos, keeper of the bedchamber. Thus, Egypt was brought low before its new Macedonia rulers. All administrative and political functions emanated from those who wielded power in Alexandria. The centuries-old Egyptian capitol of Thebes and the religious temples of Memphis which nestled in the bosom of mother Africa more than 500 miles to the south became ghost towns, museums of antiquity. Egyptian culture was relegated to the dustbin of history. From their new enclave of Alexandria, Europeans completely controlled all political and religious power in Egypt. And no African or Egyptian castrated slave sired any children in the European sanctuary of Alexandria. But then in 323 B.C., Alexander was murdered and his empire disintegrated into several pieces. Ptolemy, Alexander’s boyhood companion and general in Alexander’s army seized control of Egypt and thus the Ptolemaic dynasty was born. And some two hundred years later, Cleopatra VII became the last Ptolemaic ruler.
 
The first task Ptolemy had to accomplish after seizing control was to avoid internal conflicts, assassinations and conspiracies raging in all the other parts of Alexander’s empire. Ptolemy believed that his rule in Egypt would remain peaceful as long as Alexander remained a God. So Ptolemy resolved that the worship of Alexander would be kept intact. He created a death cult that worshipped the god, Serapis and the goddess Isis. Serapis was a fusion of Osiris and Apis. But since Alexandria was a European city the image of the god, Serapis had to be European. So Ptolemy sent his men to the town of Sinope which sat on the southern coast of the Black Sea to steal a huge Grecian statue which Ptolemy identified as the god, Serapis. It was from the town of Sinope that Diogenes came. Alexander had once said that if he had not been Alexander he would have wanted to be Diogenes. And Diogenes the Cynic had said: “Scruple not to perform the deeds of darkness in broad daylight.” Having secured the stolen image, Ptolemy housed the Sinopean statue in a great temple named the Serapion, which became a wonder and the site of pilgrimage for Europeans throughout the Mediterranean world. Ptolemy had the statue declared to be the god, Serapis, by the authority of a hierophant of the Eleusinian Mysteries and an Egyptian priest, Manetho. Serapis was enshrined as the dread god of Hades and his priests, the eunouchos, practiced ritualistic murder and other diabolical practices. And the worship of Serapis, known as the god of the living dead, and Isis became so successful for the Ptolemies that in the 5th century A.D. Macrobius says in his Saturnalia that: “In the city on the borders of Egypt which boasts Alexander of Macedon as its founder, Sarapis (sic) and Isis are worshipped with a reverence that is almost fanactical.” And indeed the pilgrims took this savage worship back to Europe where in the fifteenth century A.D. it found adherents among those opposing Egyptian culture personified by the Ottomans in the wilds of Transylvania.

Empowered by this new religion and protected by their army of castrates, the first three Ptolemies were able to peacefully plunder Egypt without any undo interference from the native Egyptians. But this peaceful interlude was shattered sometime during the reign of Ptolemy IV as the discovery of the Rosetta Stone demonstrates. Because it was then that the Macedonian plunderers learned how to translate the Egyptian hieroglyphics into Greek and as they began to unlock the secrets of the pyramids, the Ptolemies learned of new sources of fabulous wealth. From that time onward, the dynasty had to fight off attempts by Alexander’s other descendants and nobles, the Seleucids of Syria and the Antigonids of Greece, to grab Egypt’s newly found treasures for themselves. Rome also began to covet the wealth of Egypt and began to conspire with the Seleucids and Antigonids against the Ptolemies. No outrage was too great, no sacrilege too unholy for the Ptolemies to keep control. Ptolemy IV, himself, murdered his mother, his brother and his uncle to stay on the throne. In order to withstand these conspiracies, the beleaguered Ptolemies needed the assistance of several Cleopatras.

Ptolemy V married Queen Cleopatra, daughter of Antiochus, king of Greece, but to no avail. He was poisoned in 181. Ptolemy VI married Queen Cleopatra II of the noble Seleucid family. His brother Ptolemy VII had him killed and then married his widow. Afterwards Ptolemy VII had Cleopatra II, his brother’s widow killed and he married Cleopatra III, his niece, the daughter of his murdered brother and his murdered wife. Ptolemy VIII ruled jointly with his mother Cleopatra III. But his mother Queen Cleopatra III dethroned him in favor of her younger son Ptolemy IX. After the coup, Ptolemy IX promptly had his mother, Queen Cleopatra III, murdered. Cleopatra IV and Cleopatra V were daughters of Cleopatra III and Ptolemy VII. Ptolemy XI son of Ptolemy VIII and Cleopatra V had children, Ptolemy XII, Ptolemy XIII, Berenice VI, Arsinoe IV, Cleopatra VI and Queen Cleopatra VII the last ruler of the Ptolemaic dynasty. Guarded within the royal enclave of Alexandria by eunuchs, both guards and priests, initiated into the Eleusinian mysteries and adherents to the practices of a European death cult with its foundational commitment to racism, all of these Cleopatras were of noble birth and direct descendants of Macedonian families. None of them, least of all Queen Cleopatra VII were black.

It was the historian, J. A. Rogers who made the assertion that Queen Cleopatra was black in his work, World’s Great Men of Color . A scholar who did pioneering research in the area of black history, Rogers is responsible for bringing a sense of pride to black people when whites were depicting African-Americans as ‘sambos’ and ‘coons’. However, in this case, Rogers is wrong. The reason that white scholarship has not been more forceful in disproving his thesis is that they would have to admit to a death cult that still exists and reveal how theories of enclaves and segregation are imposed using religious principles for the purposes of colonization and oppression. It is these principles that can be used to trace European … as well as Islamic … expansion throughout history. In this case Rogers makes a number of errors that leads him to the wrong conclusion. Rogers incorrectly identifies Ptolemy XIII as Queen Cleopatra’s father. This mistake results from his identifying Soter II as Ptolemy XI instead of Ptolemy VIII. In reality, the father of Queen Cleopatra VII is actually Ptolemy XI. Ptolemy XIII who Rogers identifies as Cleopatra’s father is actually her brother. Rogers also states that there are no bonafide portraits of Cleopatra . This may be true in the strictest sense; however, there are plenty of pictures of Queen Cleopatra VII. For me the most striking picture of her is on a coin that she, herself, minted. On one side of the coin is the face of Mark Antony, on the opposite is Cleopatra’s face rendered in a classical Grecian image. The only way it could be argued that Cleopatra VII was black is to say that she deliberately gave herself a European image.

One of the most effective arguments against the notion that Cleopatra was black comes from contemporary sources. When Julius Caesar took Cleopatra back to Rome with him the last Punic War had been concluded less than one hundred years. Romans as well as Italians still remembered how Hannibal, a black man, had ravaged their country and how they avoided total starvation only through the goodwill of Ptolemy who supplied Rome with wheat. Cato was not alone in his opinion that “it was the right way to bring Rome to flourish, when noble-born citizens would not suffer mean-born men and upstarts … to go before them in honor…”. Certainly there would have been some protest against Caesar’s Numidian mistress as she would have been called. But none was raised. Cleopatra was accepted for what she was the Macedonian Queen of Egypt. But her attempt to make Caesar a king ended with his assassination. Certainly, if she had been black, someone would have mentioned it. And again when Plutarch describes Cleopatra’s beauty, he makes no mention of her being black. “Now her beauty (as it is reported) was not so passing, as unmatchable of other women, nor yet such as upon present view did enamor men with her …” .

There is one reference to Cleopatra VII from Plutarch that should be considered. When Octavian and Mark Antony squared off against each other in a war that will decide whether Rome or Egypt will be the center of power of the new European empire, Plutarch reports that Octavian thought little of Mark Antony chances. Caesar, correctly as it turned out, believed that Cleopatra’s domination of Antony would be his undoing despite his superior military force. In ridiculing Mark Anthony, Plutarch says: “And Caesar said furthermore, that Anthony was not master of himself, but Cleopatra has brought him beside himself by her charms and amorous poisons, and [Anthony’s war council is made up of] Mardian the eunuch … and Iras, a woman of Cleopatra’s bed chamber that frizzled [Cleopatra’s] hair and dressed her head …”. But Plutarch explains why Cleopatra needed her hair ‘frizzled’. When they appeared in public, Plutarch describes the dress of Cleopatra’s sons and then that of the queen, herself: “… she brought out Alexander in a long gown after the fashion of the Medes, with a high copped tank hat on his head, narrow in the top, as the kings of the Medes and Armenians do use to wear them; and Ptolemy appeared in a cloak after the Macedonian manner , with slippers on his feet and a broad hat, and old attire of the ancient kings and successors of Alexander the Great. “… Now for Cleopatra, she did not only wear at that time, but at all other times else when she came abroad, the apparel of the goddess Isis, and so gave audience unto all her subjects as a new Isis.” Queen Cleopatra was an initiate into the Eleusinian mysteries and the high priestess of the Ptolemaic death cult dedicated to the god Serapis as depicted by the cynic Diogenes. No black woman could have been initiated into these rites as a high priestess of those mysteries that have been the foundation of white European culture from ancient times to the present
 
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A wonderful read.. Thank you :D
 
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Please

SCwife4bulls said:
pssst. Cleopatra WAS white

......no she was not, i was just in Egpyt, and i saw all the images frome the first, middle, last kingdom. They looked more like Halle barry....a kinda of mixture with some African features.
 
lewis said:
......no she was not, i was just in Egpyt, and i saw all the images frome the first, middle, last kingdom. They looked more like Halle barry....a kinda of mixture with some African features.

Definitive photographic proof! She was mixed race. Her ancestry is Greek (white) and Egyptian (light brown). She would have had no black/African features, as it simply wasn't in her genes.
 

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